Tiller Pilot -- Benefit versus cost, need for power

[yknot]

Just for curiosity...

I've read in a few posts about Tiller tamers, Cajun Tamers, etc..  These items seem to be for a very temporary release from the tiller (to adjust a sheet, for example, or -more likely- to open a beer!).  Doesn't sound like something that I would use much- I can straddle the tiller while I open a brew!

I'm interested in hearing in anyone who invested in a Tiller Pilot (or another brand) for actual steering.  I have never used one, nor been on a smaller boat that had one installed.  I have heard that they are noisy, that's about it.  You can find them for a few hundred bucks, and it would require a marine battery on board.

Anyone with any experience?

[Bob23]

Y:
   I don't have one but a friend of mine uses an AutoTiller (Named Otto) on his Norwalk Island Sharpie, 29'. Yes, it is noisy, not loud but kind of annoying. I don't know about battery consumption; I don't think it uses too much. I use a Tiller Tamer on my 23- works great! Of course, if properly trimmed, the boat should sail itself on some points of sail.
Bob23

[yknot]

What would you say is the longest you were able to hold a course with your Tiller Tamer?  I was under the assumption that it would generally only hold a position for about 60 seconds or so.  I'm sure a lot depends on wind speed, how you are pointed, etc, but would like to hear more about your experience with it. 

I know that there is discussion elsewhere in this forum, but I do not believe anyone ever commented on the average length of time it would hold.

Rob

[kchunk]

Hi there Y. I've tried a few versions of tiller tamers. The one I like to use best is the "cajun" tiller tamer. All it is is just a length of line, one end tied off at a stern cleat, three wraps around the tiller handle, and the other end tied to the opposite stern cleat. To "engage" the tamer, hand on the triple loops on the tiller and slide them forward, this locks the tiller. To "disengage" the tamer, slide the loops aft and the tiller is free to move. With the tamer engaged, slight adjustment are made by simply rotating the triple loops on the tiller similar to the motion of a throttle on a motorcycle. Works very well. However, one caveat: this will make the varnish on your tiller FUBAR. Ah...everything has it's cost, but at least with the cajun tiller tamer you can try it before you buy a real tamer.

Here's a website I found: http://www.blumhorst.com/potterpages/Photopoint/0005/cajun-tiller-tamer.htm

As far as holding a course, no tiller tamer will do that real well. When Bob mentioned the boat should sail itself, I assume he was referring to using a tiller tamer on a close reach. Locking the tiller on a close reach, the balance between wind pressure, sail trim and weather helm, your boat should be able to sail itself to the wind almost indefinitely...not necessarily on a course per se. If the wind picks up, the weather helm will take the boat a little higher to the wind where the boat speed will drop and the locked rudder will take the boat back off the wind again and accelerate. If the wind shifts slightly, the boat should follow, heading up and falling off the wind all day, or until you run aground grabbing your 5th beer! 

[sun17cat]

I have had a couple of boats with tiller tamers and found their best use is for holding a course for a very short while you may be performing another task. I don't or would not rely on them to steer a small boat as we all know that gusts can do bad things when you least expect it. They are especially convenient when you are under power and messing with sails etc. I will probably put one on my new Sun Cat and like the one that West Marine sells for about $30.00.

Jim

[Shawn]

I haven't used my tillerpilot yet but expect it will be very nice when single handing.

One thing to keep in mind with them is they will hold your heading for you but not a track unless linked to a GPS. In other words by themselves they will just keep your boat pointed in the same direction and won't account for wind/current slip. You may have set the thing on a heading that would have cleared those rocks  in a straight line but the autopilot won't know about slippage and after sailing to wind or across a current for awhile your slipage may put you over the rocks.

With a GPS link (and an active track on the GPS) some tillerpilot models will automatically correct for cross track error if the GPS puts that out over NMEA.

For simple tiller holding the cajun looks good. I have one of these:

http://www.cansail.com/

Which is brass and stainless steel instead of the plastic in some of the other models out there.

Shawn

[sun17cat]

Are you able to tension the "Can Sail" so the rudder will stay in place but still be moveable with enough pressure on the tiller or is it totally locked until released and re-set?

[mrb]

yknot

Reamember that whether you go with an electronic tiller pilot or one of the tiller tamer systems you will have to stay alert to wind conditions as neither will trim your sails for you.  The electronic should adjust for wave conditions within reason.

The other option is wind self steering (wind vane) but that is not practical on our sizes of boat.

By working with sails and Tiller tamer type system I have been able to set and hold course for quite long periods of time.  However that was in situations where winds were constant for long periods of time and I knew the boat well.

At     sailfar.net/  there is a discussion about steering by leading jib sheet to tiller. If you find it you might find that interesting.   lol

[newt]

Guys:
As you know I am a big advocate of tiller to sheet/boom steering. I am constantly trying to improve it on my CP-23. This monday, for the first time, I got it to keep a straight course on a broad reach/run situation. Going upwind is easy, and I have used it for many hours at a time to keep the exact same course (as long as the wind doesn't change) This way I use one line, two bungies, as small wooden block attached to the tiller and two pulleys (blocks) with clips and two other clips. No electricity, no self steerer to buy and very much in line with my KISS altitude towards sailing.
As many of you know, the hardest part of self steering is keeping a course on downwind in light airs. I am experimenting with a large jib and partial blanketing by my main as the steering device. This last monday I had my setup attached to the jib sheet, with the main blanketing part of the jib. If the boat moved to windward, the sheet tighted up and the tiller pulled it back on course. It the boat moved to far to leeward, the main covered more of the jib, the sheet relaxed and the bungies pulled the tiller the other way. In light airs this last monday it worked well, but I have much more to do before I set it on  a route and go down and take a nap.
Going upwind, which is usually (for me) the most tiring type of sailing, is a snap for this setup. I set the line between the tiller and the boom, set course, then fine tune with the mainsheet tension. It can steer closer to the wind at more speed than I can. One challenge that takes some experience- the boat goes into a different trim when I go into the cabin from the cockpit, so I have to change the trim/ sheets when I go down to rest or cook something. Investing a few bucks worth of lines and blocks has completely changed sailing for me. Where once it was a he-man straining to pull the sheets while at the tiller and avoiding all dangers type activity, now I leisurely go about the process of sailing and thinking. When I go on an overnight trip or longer voyage, I get a lot of reading done out of the elements, in the cabin.
BTW- I still have a tiller tamer, but I only use it when I am coming up to a slip and the self steering is put away. I just want the tiller to stay the same when I go up and jump off onto the docks.

[Bob23]

Newt:
   Very cool! As I'm reading your post I'm trying to picture the arrangement in my head, not easy to do at 4:58 am and no coffee yet. Can you post photos or email 'em to me? We share the same KISS attitude and I'm always looking for ways to simplify.
   On another note, today is Koinonia-fix-up day. In order to meet my Saturday 1400 hrs splash date, I'm taking the day off to just work on the boat, with maybe an afternoon beer. Here in the NE, we've had a lot of rain for two days, as well as a rainy April. Weather forecast for Saturday- Sunny and 70. Thank you God!
Bob23- getting ready!

[newt]

Bob- I knew you couldn't sell her!! And she gets more fun as you release yourself from the bondage of the tiller! I think I'm going to have to start a new thread and document the system in depth. It started with the same system that is on the Flicka website, but I have further simplified it and adjusted it for the Compac. As most on this website know, the Compac is a great little boat, but she is often headstrong in wanting to head windward. This system kinda mellow that out alot.
First read that stuff attached to the Flicka site. It is the simplest steering I could find on the Web.
Next- where shall we post her? I guess I will open a thread in Tips and Tech. area when I get it all together.
Finally- I am awful about taking pictures....I am kinda like an old New Mexican (I am one) I feel that a picture somehow steals the experience from me.  But for this project I will bring a photographer. I need new pictures anyway-I am always old and fat in the other ones.
So anyway, I'll get off my soapbox and try to get it together this weekend. Good luck with the Splash Bob!

[Craig Weis]

Skip here, I use a Fore-Spar mechanical 'tiller tamer'. Simply an extendable and locked bar with a ball at the end that I fit into a socket on either side of the cockpit combing. I like it and have used it to hold coarse for as long as two + hours with sails properly trimmed. Broad reach or just a Little pinched up. Never wing to wing or in a following sea.

Picture is in the Frappr album below posted three-eleven-2009.
[img][http://s259.photobucket.com/albums/hh299/1930fordroadster/?action=view&current=1de0929a619a0cb8da587b0e645ee6950_m.jpg/img]

[Bob23]

Newt:
   I am anxiously awaiting to see the thread in Tips and Techs. However, for me, I like my hand on the tiller and the Tiller Tamer I use seems to work ok. But at the same time, I'm always intrigued by any type of wind vane or self-steering system.
  Ahh...the Flicka! I try to stay away from that site for that is absolutely my favorite little (?) boat. She draws a bit too much for my thin water here in Manahawkin and Southern Barnegat bay but they are beautiful. There's one in a nearby marina that hasn't seen water in 3 or more years. Hmm..I wonder...
   Yesterday was a very productive day..got everything done except for waxing. I'll do that tomorrow morning. Here in NJ, the forecast for Saturday is mid 70's, brisk West wind. Launch is still scheduled for 1400 hrs local time. Usually the night before I don't sleep much, kinda like Christmas eve when we were kids. Too much excitement and anticipation. Can't wait!
Bob23- off to drink da java, mon!
ps- I have a forespar tiller extension with the ball...just never got the socket thing together.

[newt]

As I look back on my post I see it was a bit egostical. I hope I am not really that stuck on myself. I will try a present  photos of the self-steering in a straight forward way. How do you post pictures in here? I can't seem to make it work.

[kinnakeet]

Just for curiosity...

I've read in a few posts about Tiller tamers, Cajun Tamers, etc..  These items seem to be for a very temporary release from the tiller (to adjust a sheet, for example, or -more likely- to open a beer!).  Doesn't sound like something that I would use much- I can straddle the tiller while I open a brew!

I'm interested in hearing in anyone who invested in a Tiller Pilot (or another brand) for actual steering.  I have never used one, nor been on a smaller boat that had one installed.  I have heard that they are noisy, that's about it.  You can find them for a few hundred bucks, and it would require a marine battery on board.

Anyone with any experience?

Tiller tamers have limited effectiveness on small boats because your weight shift will  change the heading.  Tie off your tiller and move into the cabin for a brew and you will see how ineffective  it can be