Torqeedo 1003 electric outboard use

[Jim in TC]

Connection issues are different with the Torqueedo. All of the connectors are fully threaded and quite robust, but it is easy to screw one in and have it seem snug but not quite snug enough (especially, I have found, the throttle connection). The dreaded error message is the result, in this case a connection issue which requires the cable to be removed (or at least further loosened) and then fully threaded back in. And, as I perhaps wrongly recall, turn the system off and back on. After that experience, which naturally occurred in big wind and heavy chop, I am more deliberate about nice tight connections, and also use a bit of electrical connection cleaner (probably not much different from WD-40, actually) every month or two.

[Renae]

While I experience failure of the battery connector at the same place that Bruce did (and my replacement did not go well), the more concerning design issue is the fact that you cannot pin the motor into the straight, non-pivot position without removing the battery.

If switching from fixed to pivoting is important, you could position the battery inside the boat (probably in the gas tank cuddy), connecting with a cable.  This would leave the locking pin readily accessible.

Nitpicking aside, I am still far happier with the ePropulsion than my former gas motor (Tohatsu).  The reduction in noise alone makes the sale as far as I am concerned. 

[DanM]

To answer an earlier question, yes you can tilt up the Torqeedo on a SunCat, or at least I can on mine (a 2012). But you have to have the fixed-steering pin removed so you can swivel the motor sideways. I tried to post a picture but it didn't work.

[Jim in TC]

To answer an earlier question, yes you can tilt up the Torqeedo on a SunCat, or at least I can on mine (a 2012). But you have to have the fixed-steering pin removed so you can swivel the motor sideways. I tried to post a picture but it didn't work.

To clarify ours: we tilt the motor up, but not with the tiller attached. With the pin removed, you can tilt the motor over or, as I prefer, lash it up with a line and hook from the boom gallows. Or check out Bruce's nifty hookup (is that in another thread?).

We Torqueedo owners pick the same nit that Renae does: you are pretty well stuck with the locking pin in or out, and some kind of tensioning system that would be easy to manage would be a welcome improvement. Still, having no gasoline motors other than a little used car makes me happy!

[Jon898]

Of course you can save beaucoup dollars and go with a trolling motor, driven from a deep cycle battery which can then double as a house battery.  As a side benefit, most trolling motors have props that are designed to resist weed entanglement.

Several years ago I changed the noisy, balky, Yugoslavian 3hp Tomos for a 30lb thrust Minnkota on the PC, linked to a deep cycle battery forward of the mast (thus helping with trim).  The silence and low impact on the boat-dollars is wonderful.

Just sayin'.

Jon

[bruce]

I don't remember if these guides have been posted before, but they may be useful.
https://plugboats.com/electric-outboards-less-than-5-kw/
https://plugboats.com/electric-trolling-motors/

Jim, I posted the tilting line on Boat and Hardware Mods.
https://cpyoa.com/forum/index.php?topic=11925.0

[Renae]

I wouldn't personally try to push/pull a Suncat with a conventional trolling motor, but if you're only going to go out in conditions where a paddle would do, then why not?

[FireDrill]

Thank you all for the extremely informative responses!   Lots of great information.    

First,  I learned that there is an alternative to Torqeedo, ie the ePropulsion products... It looks like there are pluses and minuses to each,  perhaps ePropulsion  being slightly favored but still trying to sort through those. Both meet my need for easy start and less or no leaning over the stern for that part. 

Both look like I'd still have some orthopedic/geezer/single handing  challenges to get the motor out of the water, on a tilt,  except for Bruce's gallows arrangement. (nice job!)  I'd probably use a fiddle becket cam arrangement on gallows since I'm not as much of a craftsman.   I gather that the standard up-position is straight out at 90 degrees to the transom and held there by inserting a pin behind the housing.  Is the pin mounted or do you have to find it and insert it in a hole?  How far astern is it?

Both look like they have problems with weeds.  My Yamaha 4 could not get through weeds.   In one marina where  I had a slip in for 2 years I could not get out from the last week in July till early Sept because of increasing weeds. No forward /reverse sequences worked etc.  Motor clogged so bad it died within 3 boat lengths.  I have moved to a new place with less weeds but still have to get out of slip by a boat length via paddles with motor in neutral ...weeds near surface, then a little deeper .  I assume there is no neutral (blade spinning freely? , just an off position?  From what I read I gather both electrics are worse than my Yamaha.  Right?

Steering with the either motor's tiller is still not clear.  Sounds like the Torqeedo would bump into gallows or stern,? I was not sure  if ePropulsion does this?    I need both the boat tiller and the motor tiller to get out of my current slip, Boat tiller does not do it alone,  because of low speed.

The remote controls sound ideal for much single handing.

Also I'd like to see the connector issues in a dealer location.  I am talking with a dealer about a demonstrator-used  1003 so I can probable see that one - not sure about ePropulsion dealers near Rochester or Buffalo NY?  Will look on ePropulsion Web site ..   

Sorry for delay in responding, many personal issues including helping with remote learning for grandkids!

Thanks again for all the responses!

FireDrill

   
     

[Renae]

You're not going to be able to get the tiller of the eProp behind the transom of your Suncat.  Here's what I recommend as a fellow Suncatter of near-geezer status:

Get a remote version of whichever motor you prefer.  I have the eProp and many folks are also satisfied with the Torqeedo.  If you get the eProp, I think the Spirit Plus model is now available in the remote version.  The battery connections are improved and there is more energy storage.

When you get the motor, run it pinned straight 90% of the time.  Either motor will tend to rotate freely if not pinned, which can lead to trouble.  For a tight spot, they can be easily turned by hand.  The eProp pin is under the battery, so if you plan on switching back and forth, consider getting the accessory cable to mount the battery inside the boat (gas storage compartment) and figure out how to make it secure.  I'm sure Torqeedo has a similar option.

Don't stress about raising and lowering the motor.  It's a lot easier than any gas outboard you have managed.

I occasionally see a used Torqeedo for sale, but never an eProp.  I would personally buy new to get the warrantee as I have already had to avail myself of it.  These things never go on sale, so buy when you are ready.

One further comment on my previous post.  I don't know your sailing conditions, but if you are relatively sheltered, without current on reasonably flat water, a trolling motor might suffice.  I've considered picking one up on Craigslist as a backup.  They are cheap and plentiful now.

[bruce]

Having used both the 1003 with remote and the Spirit 1.0R both are excellent choices, and any issues about tilting, controlling pivot, etc., can be dealt with.

Both motors lack a means of tightening the pivot, I don't know why. Both provide a plastic pin to lock the pivot, and both require you to remove the battery to do it. A problem underway, for me anyway. Some just put the pin in and never steer with the motor, I steer with the motor routinely and won't give that up. I believe that is the pin you refer to. The 1003 I used pivoted much too easily, the Spirit was better but not quite tight enough. In both cases I was able to tighten the pivot by taking off a wedge-shaped cover on the back of the motor, under the head. In that compartment, both motors have a plastic clamp around the conduit. For the 1003, I installed a thin leather shim. For the Spirit, it was sufficient to just tighten down on the clamping screws. I can add a shim if necessary.

For the 1003, I do have a design mind for an external, spring-loaded locking pin that would be in accessed from the front of the motor, convenient from the cockpit. The pin could lock the motor on C/L, or be disengaged so the motor pivots freely. Details on request. I haven't come up with a similar design for the Sprit, but I haven't found it to be necessary once I tightened the pivot.

Tilting the motor is similar to what you have now. A lever on the side that has to be disengaged, no loose pin. The Sprit lever was hard to find, so I installed a larger handle that is easier to locate by feel. The photo was taken before the larger handle was installed.

I steer with the motor by just twisting the motor head, I don't want another tiller in the cockpit. This is at low speeds, and I'm often facing aft anyway. The Spirit does have a little handle I can grab, seen in the tilting line photos.

Weeds are going to be a problem. The electric OB props are bigger anyway, and I wouldn't be surprised if the software would sense the added drag and shut down to prevent overheating the motor. The blade will spin if being dragged through the water, i.e. not under power.

I hadn't heard that a Spirit 1.0 Plus Remote version had been released. I certainly hope they will, if they haven't. I don't know about availability of the Spirit 1.0 Remote being discontinued, but I would prefer to get the new model. Besides the connector, the other upgrades are useful.

One of the advantages of the Spirit is the brushless DC motor, no gearing necessary. It is a little quieter than the 1003, but I noticed that more in the videos than in person. Both are pleasing quiet. The Torqeedo 1103 is also brushless DC, but the motor bulb is significantly larger the the 1003. So much so, there may be issues with striking the rudder in use with the factory motor mount position. Check that out carefully if you decide to go that way.

If you haven't seen these reviews by a British dealer check them out. They include head-to-head comparisons of the 1003/1103 and Spirit.
https://nestawayboats.com/shop/torqeedo-travel-1003s-1003l/
https://nestawayboats.com/shop/epropulsion-spirit-plus-1kw-electric-outboard/

[DanM]

    Firedrill- in answer to this statement: "Steering with the either motor's tiller is still not clear.  Sounds like the Torqeedo would bump into gallows or stern,?" To be clear- yes, I can steer with the Torqeedo, the tiller does indeed clear the gallows. and steering is no more awkward that it was with the Honda5.

[Jim in TC]

Less elegant ways to hold the motor tilted up (to prevent slamming over on its side) are 1) easing it over on its side and 2) running a line and a hook from the gallows, with the hook engaging the battery handle (I thought I had a picture, but can't find it).

You will want to lock the motor down with the easy-access lever to be able to use reverse more effectively. On ours the spring-loaded lever that should keep the motor tilted up has never been reliable so I need to help it along (again, easy access). Tilting at geezer age is easy with the 1003.

I keep the tiller handy and sometimes use it at the dock (if wind is potentially a factor) but more often just pivot the motor around as needed, per Bruce's comment. When wind and waves are high I slip the tiller into position for easy control when dousing sail, and also 'lock' it into a wood bracket I made to prevent the motor pivoting on its own. In bigger waves we get a sort of 'almost cavitation' that can make the motor turn when we are pretty busy already. Our first few times out I had the locking pin installed, which prevented that nicely but gave us no control with the motor; steerage with the motor is a big enough advantage to work out a way to keep it mobile. The picture of that bracket is probably in the same folder as the above hook system.

[bruce]

Jim,

I remember your photos, you posted them on the Torqeedo Battery Recall thread, reply #8, 8/14/19
https://cpyoa.com/forum/index.php?topic=11523.0

[DanM]

Having been on the boat yesterday, I'd like to mention one other thing I like about the Torqeedo. The Honda 5, which it replaced, REALLY did not want to go slow. As we'd approach a mooring or dock, I had to guess the momentum from a distance, and often give the motor a goose or two to get us there. More than once, trying to go slow, it just coughed and quit. I'm not experienced enough to know how typical this is of small outboards or if it was just my old Honda. In any case, the Torqeedo is happy to run really slow and can ease the SunCat to the mooring under much more control.

[bruce]

I have a similar issue with my Lehr 2.5, it has a neutral, but no reverse. Even at idle, it still drives the boat faster than I want when landing, so I have to shift in and out of neutral. Not a big deal, but the electrics I've used are much better at that.

My Honda 2 had a centrifugal clutch, that would slip when you idled down. Once you get used to it it gives you good control. The problem there is, when the motor is cold, and you're first starting, you have to throttle up, so the second the motor starts the clutch is engaged and it's off to the races. Firmly tied to the dock it was manageable, but I found it best to warm up the motor before launching. It was air cooled, so didn't need to have water for the pump. A few minutes running dry, until you could throttle down, wasn't a problem.