Having both furling foresail *and* separate forestay for hank-on sails?

[SSouris]

Hello, all.  I'm new to this website and am thinking about buying a new Com-Pac 23.

Does anyone know if it's possible on a Com-Pac 23 to have both a furling foresail system *and* the ability to use a separate forestay for a hank on sail when that's preferred for a particular occasion over the furling sail?  It's my impression that a furling sail is best when it can be pulled out all the way and not so good when it has to be furled partly, especially say in 25 knots  sailing upwind when it would need to be reduced to something like a heavy weather jib.  Here's what I have in mind but I'd like feedback:  Rig a furling foresail system with perhaps a 135 Genoa.   Have a separate forestay cable attached to the top of the mast and "stored" out of the way at, let's say, the base of the mast with appropriate tension using some kind of quick release hardware.  When needed, it could be quickly released from the base of the mast and moved over to a piece of hardware pre-installed on the bowsprit several inches aft of the furling foresail mechanism.  That piece of hardware would allow for a quick installation—perhaps something like what Com-Pac describes for its Mastendr system on the Mastendr Pictorial webpage:  "Attach the forestay tang to the stemhead with the quick-clevis pin. Tension the rigging by simply pulling down on the forestay self-locking lever."  (http://www.com-pacyachts.com/mastendr-mastraising.html)  There would have to be a separate halyard available, of course, just for this auxiliary forestay.  The furling foresail sheets might have to be removed from the furled Genoa so they're not in the way of the hank-on sail; then the  furled Genoa could be kept tight through some other method so it doesn't unravel.  If the length of the auxiliary forestay that gets stored at the base of the mast isn't sufficient to reach the piece of hardware on the bowsprit when it's moved up there from the base of the mast, an extension piece could be added to make up the difference.  What do you all think of this idea?   Surely I'm not the only one to want to be able to have both a furling foresail and the ability to put up a hank-on sail on occasion instead of using the furling sail. 

[Shawn]

http://www.sailmagazine.com/diy/sails/convert-your-sloop-to-a-double-headsail-rig/

[deisher6]

Hey Shawn, Great reference, thanks.
regards charlie

[Duckie]

I have that setup on my CP 16.   I haven't had to use it yet, but I am pretty happy that I have it if I need it.  I also have several head sails that can be hanked on to match the conditions.  Mine is set up to be fastened to the mast out of the way of the roller furled genoa until needed then it can be hooked to the  bow sprit about 6 or 7 inches behind the rolled up genoa.  The second forestay has a dedicated hound below the main headstay so that the two stays are pretty much parallel.  There is a shroud tensioner on the second stay also. 

I am a single hander, so it will be a real Chinese fire drill to get that all set up with a smaller jib after rolling the genoa up.  I am more inclined to rig both head stays and leave the genoa alone if I think the day might get dicey.  Anyway, I think that it is a real solid solution to all the folderol of dealing with a furler in stronger winds. 

Al

[SSouris]

Thanks, all, for these suggestions.  I had never heard about a Solent Stay before but was pleased to learn about that option.  I Googled the phrase "Solent Stay" and found more info. about it in addition to that Sail Magazine article.  Meanwhile, I learned about another option called the Gale Sail.  It's very clever.  In essence, it involves  making a regular, traditional  sail so that it will have a sleeve of sorts at the luff allowing the sail to be raised over and along the furled foresail.  (The "sleeve" allows the free-standing sail to fit around the furled foresail.)  You need a halyard, of course, but could use the spinnaker halyard.  Gale Sail specializes making from scratch heavy weather sails (Gale Sails) for any size boat.  It will also retrofit a conventional hank-on sail.  The outcome is a foresail for heavy weather that has a proper shape (vs. a reefed foresail).  Gale Sail will also make from scratch or retrofit a sail that's larger than whatever sail you have on the furling mechanism, such as a drifter.  The cost for any retrofit work is $22 per foot of luff for retrofitting.  Expensive, to be sure.  Gale Sail's webpage is: <http://www.atninc.com/atn-gale-sail-sailing-equipment.shtml>  I don't know if he has a patent on this procedure (he appears to)  or if it has become a generic procedure by now that any sail maker can offer.  ~ SSouris

[HeaveToo]

The Solent Stay is a good option.  I would imagine that the gale sail would be better for a larger boat and I would think that it could chaffe the sail under it.

I carry a 150 and a 110.  If it is going to blow and I know it I will rig the 110 and jacklines before I leave the harbor. 

I will put it this way...If I heard that I was going to go out in my sailing area, the Chesapeake Bay, and I would less sail area than a 110 that is slightly rolled in and a reefed main I would keep my anchor in the mud.  No way would I be going out. 

That being said, I wouldn't mind a second reef point in my main "Just in case."  Still, with a second reef point and a rolled 110 I could probably forereach in really bad weather if I was stuck in it. 

I have carried a reefed main and a rolled 150 upwind in 20 knots of wind.  I was okay.  The smaller 110 jib partly rolled, say down to 90%, would make a big difference there.

Once I made the mistake of going into a full gale at a really bad point.  I was out at Smith Point in the Chesapeake Bay and I was heading into the Potomac River.  Wind was straight on the nose.  I motored into this and got the crap beat out of me for 5 hours.  The Compac 23 would have been much worse and I was in a Catalina 30.  If I was faced with the same issue I would tuck tail and run into a harbor that was in a different direction.  Beating into 25 knots of wind is hard on the boat and the crew!