three point rig

[Bob23]

Kick:
   You may be able to use those 8' doors if you get low headroom track. Not that I'm a garage door guru but I've been making a living masquerading as a general contractor. Is the header over your door loadbearing? Of course it's not...if I'd only really read before opening my big mouth!
   Sounds like your  heart is set on the 19. I've only been aboard 2 but was impressed with the room. Keep us posted. Can we start another name gaming contest?
Bob23

[capt_nemo]

I went from a THREE POINT (3) rig to a SIX (6) Point rig on my Sun Cat with no difficulty whatsoever in raising or lowering the mast. The main thing to remember is to keep all the wire ORGANIZED and SECURED with short ball bungees.

Since I installed a 4' bowsprit to experiment and play with various mast head headsails, thought that for safety sake I should reinforce the upper 4' of UNSUPPORTED mast. So, I doubled the shrouds, adding masthead length shrouds to the same chain plates as the originals, and made an additional quick-release masthead forestay to attach to the bowsprit end. The original quick-release forestay was retained, attached to the cleat close in front of the mast like a baby stay.

Made all the extra rigging components myself and am quite satisfied with the well supported mast.

capt_nemo

[skip1930]

No way would I consider doing away with the stern standing rig on my CP-19, with or without moving the chain plates around.
When I fly my asymmetrical star cut spinnaker it's amazing how hard the bow is driven down into the water. I want a back stay.

skip.

[Lafayette Bruce]

Kick-
Based on a few calculations and the attached graph I would estimate when running down wind the load on each shroud would be 2.7x the load on the standard backstay.  (Good thing there are two shrouds otherwise the load would double.)  I really wouldn't go there.


Lafayette Bruce

[Eagleye]

Our friends at Com-Pac designed the Eclipse with a three-point rig. I wonder how they made the design work...or should I be worried??? 

-Allen

[Lafayette Bruce]

Allen
I would think since it is designed that way and naval architects were involved, I would think you are good.  I just wouldn't want to be moving stuff like shrouds around in a light hearted way.
Lafayette Bruce

[skip1930]

I read where the Cutty Sark windjammer in full rig running in the 'Roaring 40's' had generated several million pounds to push her through the seas!

Pretty sure she was well stayed.

skip.

[Bob23]

Allen:
   Worry not. Your Eclipse has swept back spreaders which kind of eliminates the need for a backstay. The chainplates are aft of the centerline of the mast so they take any forward force placed on the mast. Capece?
    Personlly, I like the 8 point rig on my 23.  But then I do tend to lean toward redundancy, redundancy, redundancy, redundancy.......
Bob23

[kickingbug1]

    well the three point rig idea has been settled. since the 19 i am considering has a spinnaker, the backstay is essential. if the owner co-operates i might have a barge in the garage before christmas. i measured again. i have a foot to spare lengthwise and maybe a half inch in height. what a beast compared to my 16

[Bob23]

Kick:
Let me be the first to pre-congratulate you on the possible purchase of the 19!
Bob23

[Billy]

This is great news!

You'll love the boat. And won't regret leaving the backstay.

[mattman]

Kick, you know I have been thinking about this a bit. On the 16 that bottom of the stick is flat with the bolt hole drilled center. If that is the case on the 19 then you could step from the bow. My O'day 23 stepped that way, much much easier than stepping from the cockpit. the OP even had a roller welded to the bow and stern pulpit to roll the mast forward.'I did have to loosen the shrouds but kept them marked and only took a few moments to readjust. Used the main halyard until I attached the backstay. all in all I could step that stick by myself in about 5 minutes including adjusting the turnbuckles . Next to the 16 that 23 was the easiest boat I have trailed. I used bungees to take up tension on the shrouds and keep them off the deck while cruising down the highway.  Just a thought. Matt

[Salty19]

Yeah, problem is you can't get any leverage until the aft of mast (in down but bolted-in position) is raised a tad. It will just want to move the whole thing forward due to the angle of the line over pulpit to masthead. Pretty much a horizontal arrangement. At least that's been my experience. Now once the mast is up about 4-5' off the cockpit seat plane, the halyard will pull it right up. Maybe the pulpit was tall on your O'day?

I suppose you could just make a system to hold the aft end up temporarily, or perhaps the Admiral might help. 

By the way, do not get the boom vang bail that bolts onto the base of the mast (shared pivot bolt ) like we have if you are trailer sailing.  The curse words will scare the children. And don't get a furler either..again, more cursing.  We wrestle with them each time, but only doing it three times a year, we deal with it.

[mattman]

Salty, I meant to communicate that I just lifted the mast to vertical, then used the halyard for a few moments to walk back and attach the backstay. Leverage is not an issue. Not sure I understand your statement about the vang, I would think you would slip the pin through before lifting the mast, or simply move it up a few inches on it's own fasteners if it were getting hung up on something. Point I wanted to make for Kicking was there may be an easier options for stepping the upcoming 19 with out swapping the  rig. Btw, I don't really see all that many problems with the three point rig, it has it's pro's and con's. Can't say that one would be better than another, just better in certain circumstances and worse in others. Best of luck guys.   

[Salty19]

Hi Matt, no problem, that makes sense, and you're right once the mast is up, holding it up with a halyard is real easy.

The vang bail is a pain because it's a little wider than the mast foot, so spacers are needed for good alignment(or at least I prefer they are there).  Lining up the mast, bail, and foot with close clearance between the bail and deck..while inserting spacers and bolt, you need three hands. The long bolt through bail, mast and foot tends to need a lot of persuasion (hammer) to remove.  It just slows things down, so a pure trailer sailor it will add time and frustration.    But a slipped boat, the extra 5-10 mins of setup time is irrelevant for the advantages of the vang.