Interior renovation ideas

[HideAway]

I guess my advice is not to over design it.  The 23 is a great pocket cruiser but you are not going to live aboard it.  HideAway is hull number 2 so it is a very basic boat-no where near the storage or the luxury the later models have.  The biggest change was to convert the vee berth to storage and adding a vanity for sanitary reasons.  I keep our three jibs, tools, assorted stuff found on most boats there with great success. The other major change was converting  the 5 gallon portapottie to a deck pump out.  Its no longer portable but its much easier to pump than carry.   I get by with this because the main cabin does not have shelves along the settees.  Sleeping on the settees allows better air flow and instant access to the cockpit not to mention the space is huge compared to the vee berth area.
I wouldn't dream of cooking below, preferring our Coleman camp stove in the cockpit where I can watch for idiots throwing wakes.  Our under sink storage has emergency items such as the fire extingusher, first aid, plugs,flares, binoculars & such. food is stored in a series of small coolers labeled and packed for each day. Next cruise will feature ice held up by bubble wrap layers. Longer cruises will have dry ice. 
Comparing the 23 with the Flicker is like comparing the 16 to the 23.  My 23 looks like a toy next to the Flicker. The Flicker seldom sails btw -very hard to launch.   All that being said we just returned from a 90 plus mile cruise spending 5 nights and 6 days aboard with no problems with accommodations at all-maybe we are just used to small spaces   Keep it simple-keep it functional.  Matt     

[zigguratzero]

Hello again all,

Based on the great feedback that I got from everyone on my original interior redo, I present to you... pause for dramatic effect... interior renovation ideas, part 2.

Some problems with previous design that hopefully have been addressed:
   Side berths not wide enough for comfortable sleeping.
   No access to bilge.
   Not enough ventilation for stove in v-berth.


Side berths - In place of the full cabinets at the side berths, I'm showing a simple shelf that also acts as a support for the removable cushioned seat back (thanks for the idea, Brackish!) This would allow for a hopefully comfortable seating experience and a roomy sleeping experience.



Same thing with scale figure:










Galley - I'm still going with the idea of sacrificing sleeping space for one person in favor of having a more substantial galley, only instead of taking a spot in the v-berth, I am now using one side berth for the galley. As pointed out by several people, this placement is better for ventilation, and is also subject to less boat rocking. To access the galley, you would remove the seat cushion and pull the handle to slide the galley out along a set of grooves. The galley is shown with a 12"x12" sink and a single burner stove. I'm also showing a slide out drawer for the cooler (similar to Brackish's idea). Dimensions are based a 25 quart cooler, but maybe a bigger one could be used if it were the right proportions. I'm also showing a drawer for additional storage above the cooler. All of this could in theory be removed for bilge access. (Although how that drawer above the cooler could be mounted in a way that would leave no obstructions once removed I don't know. I'd have to research some mounting solutions, so maybe that drawer is not feasible.)









Chart desk - Similar to the one from No Mas (thanks for the link, Nate)


V-berth - Pretty much the same as before, only without the galley. I figured this area would probably suit me better for sleeping since it would accommodate my wingspan much better. That and the wife and I could sleep side by side. If possible, I would probably lengthen the v-berth area at the expense of the storage area to accommodate my height (thanks Shawn!)







Table - Shawn's method of using a slightly trimmed version of the original table sounds like it could work for me. It could potentially be stored next to the cooler when not in use. Didn't model this one.

Sliding privacy doors - Same as before.














Also, just to clarify, in my previous post I didn't mean to suggest that the 23 could be the equivalent of a Flicka, or any bluewater cruiser for that matter. The pictures of the Dana and the Flicka were meant to inspire details, not meant to suggest the the 23 could actually be that roomy. I've added people into the images to hopefully give a better sense of scale!

Thanks to everyone for your invaluable feedback. You really helped me gain a clearer picture of what I would be dealing with if I decide to go this route with my future boat. I'm still undecided on whether I should look for a boat that costs a bit more but is in good condition and just enjoy it as it is, or one that is less expensive but needs a "bit" of renovating. I'll just have to see what's out there.

Also, this design is of course in no way "final" so thoughts and/or criticisms are as always welcome!

[NateD]

I think the changes from your original design are improvement. A few things to consider. I like to sit on the companion way step while I cook/wash dishes. It is hard on the back to be crouched over for a long period, but sitting on the step (with the hatch open) is comfortable place to be. You might move the step(s) onto the same side of the boat as the galley, and move the cooler to the other side, but of course you'll lose easy access to the bilge, maybe a door behind the stair(s) that opens into that space?

Second, where do the cushions go when they are removed (quarter berth back rests and cushion that comes out when the galley is used)? You could use one to fill in the area between the quarter berths, but that doesn't seem very useful unless your wife is short enough to sleep in the quarter berth with the galley. You might have to make each back rest in two parts so it is small enough to wrestle into the v-berth area at night, or put a hinge on the back rests so they fold in half for storage in the v-berth. Instead of removing a cushion to allow the galley to slide out, how about heavy duty roller bearing drawer slides and mount the pullout a little higher than the cushion so that it can remain in place when you pull out the galley? Also in one picture it looks like the galley pullout has drawers in the bottom half of it, in another picture it doesn't. Adding drawers to the bottom would be a great storage space for pots/pans/cooking utensils.

[Shawn]

This layout looks more functional.

You might see if you can make the removable back cushions fill in the floor area of the quarter berths.

I'd suggest considering flip flopping the sink and stove. Functionally having the sink comes out first makes sense (use it more often) but that ends up having the plumbing have to be longer and would eat up some potential storage in that cabinet below the sink/stove.

With the stove first you get more clearance from the heat source to the companionway bulkhead when fully extended. Also if you partially extend it you can cook (or just heat up water) while taking up less interior space than if the stove was on the inside. As cooking takes longer than using the sink that seemed to be a good tradeoff to me. As mine is open below if I had the sink forward the plumbing would be more in the way of a sleeping persons feet.

With the cooler setup you might be able to simply use that as the companionway step if it is strong enough. That would free up a little more room too.

Shawn

[HideAway]

I think you are on the right path with your design.  I would recommend sailing the boat a bit before you make the changes though.  My wife pointed out that since we live in a warm climate we don't need a galley below decks. The same thing applies to the chart table.  We use a hatch board for a table in the cockpit and below when needed.  The privacy doors seem over the top to me.  They add weight and the thought of them crashing about on a screaming reach is scary.  We have a piece of heavy canvas mounted with screws to the bulk head and held open with velcro. Very impressed with your images -- Matt   

[zigguratzero]

Thanks Nate, Shawn, and Matt for your practical feedback and great ideas! There are definitely more refinements to be made.

The idea of engineering the seat backs to fill the center space to create a large berth is an intriguing one (thanks Nate). I will continue to play around to see if it could be doable. Also the cooler step idea could be quite practical. I could probably use a larger cooler that way as well (thanks Shawn).

I'll update you again after I've made a purchase - hopefully in the not too distant future! Thanks again.

[Bob23]

Zig:
   Many of my construction problems are solved in my sleep and the other day I woke up around 0200 hrs with this thought: The bulkhead in the 23 is not cast in concrete. All we need to do is to figure out a way to transfer the load from the mast to the keel. What about a c-shaped structural beam similiar to half of an oval walk through opening which is common on many older and some newer boats? Using this, the entire existing bulkhead could be removed, the c-beam installed and that would free up one entire side of the boat to be open from front to back, Flicka style. I think using laminated layers of plywood, such a beam would not be hard to build.
Bob23