Trailer Puzzler: hot hub

[Citroen/Dave]

My CP16 came with an 1985 Hutch trailer.  The previous owner prepared it for a two state haul by purchasing new hubs, bearings, rims, grease, and tires. Thanks to his forsight
I had an uneventful haul thought the Allegheny and Blue Ridge Mountains.

In my overly cautious mode, I purchased a new axle.  That is when we discovered water in one bearing from the single immersion when the trail lifted my new boat out of an Ohio Lake.  Moral of that story: use bearing buddies!

When the new axle was installed, I had the dealer clean and replace the grease to a synthetic that he and I agreed upon.

Problem: since then and for the last 100 miles my left hub has been over heating. [Right hub 110 degrees; left hub 145 degrees after 12 miles of driving.]  The dealer has four times torn down that hub and replaced everything. Never any sign of anything wrong.  He has even backed off the nut to "slightly loose" and even torn down the other hub just to take a look.  His next try will be to replace the hub as though it somehow was damaged causing the bearing race to 'ovalize'.

Has anybody had a similar problem or can you think what else might be going on?

(The only other clue: the mechanic said he replaced the new Ohio 1" bearings with 1 1/8" bearings when he installed the new square axle. I did not think to ask him what that meant when I last saw him a few minutes ago.)

[MacGyver]

In my experience (one time had a similar issue) and it was the hub wasnt totally round.  Not sure why as one would think the process of making them would be setup as to be "true" when complete.....

The only other issue I ran into was one time the Race wasnt right, but that was pretty evident when spin testing after re assembly.....

Hope they solve it,

Here is some information for you:
As long as the grease isn't melting you are ok. Expect non brake temps to run up to around 120. If you have brakes here are the numbers
180-200 normal
250 o-rings fail in covers
300 seals fail

<100 check less often
100 -200 keep checking @ 50 miles
200 - 300 Let 'em cool, check more often
>300 find out what's wrong

Also, be sure that the hotter side wasnt running in the sun before checking, as this can warm temps up a bit thermally.
Brake hubs will run hotter than non brake hubs.

^^^ This is all the information I have on my computer in note documentation. Hope it is of some use

Mac

[Citroen/Dave]

Mac,

Thanks for your response.  I'm going to suggest that the trailer shop rotate my two new hubs: If the other side get hot it has to be the hub.  If the same side gets hot it has to be the axle.  That test will not cause him to to swap out any more new parts.

No brakes on the Hutch.

More to come.
Dave

[deisher6]

Hey Citroen/Dave:
The replacement axle for our C16 has a xerk fitting on each end which channels grease to the inside bearings, it works better than a bearing buddy.  We just trailered it 2018 miles and the axles stayed cool to the touch.  Of course it was below freezing for parts of the trip.
I consider the grease arrangement better than bearing buddies.

regards charlie

[Citroen/Dave]

Thanks, Charlie.  I wondered about that.  I will take a closer look next time the repare shop has the hub off, probably next Wednesday. . .

[ribbed_rotting_rusting]

I thought maybe axle mis- alignment or brakes dragging, but no brakes and both sides would experience trouble if it was the axle.Did the mechanic replace the race when he replaced the bearing, sizing up? Circles and cables, lines anything round have the potential to grown in strength, weight, and potential trouble in increments that almost seem negligible. Take the 1 inch bearing. Its base circumference is pi(3.1416)x dia (1 inch)=3.1416 inches.   The larger bearing which is 1.125 " x 3.1416= 3.5343  That means the larger bearing is almost 1/2 larger around   no way does it fit right. It would be one of two ways I think, either loose and sloppy or interference and "smashmouth". Either way it could not do its proper job of both relieving friction and dispersing the heat of friction. Rather than switching those bearings I would try to get them to pull that bearing and match it with what the specs call for. You might ask them to pull the other side and check it.

Because the mechanic was honest with you about what he has done, if that is what  was done, I would just suggest you heard about something similar and that why you brought it up. Why burn the guy for being honest? If you ever do business there again, I'm sure that there is one mechanic who will be straight with you in the future.

[InertBert]

does it make any noise?  Are you measuring the temp at the hub surface with an ir thermometer or how are you getting those numbers?  if the grease is only getting to 145f, you are probably fine.  If the bearing race is much hotter and you're measuring the temp a few inches away, then who knows.

[Bob23]

Dave:
   I know this seems basic but have you checked the air pressure in the tires? I'm sure you have.
Bob23

[Citroen/Dave]

Tire pressure OK.  Axle alignment good. Infrared scan for the temperatures.

I still have not gotten a response to the early comment of "I installed 1 1/8 inch bearings", but if they were wrong both sides would have over heated.  He is going to build a new hub and try again next Monday.  Great guy to work with and I tip him at the completion of the work; he has helped me with several items.

[nies]

If I were to guess a error in the size of one of the races, having spent my life trying to solve mystery equipment problems...............rule one " what has changed?".........................rule two "only change one thing at a time".................................rule three "go back and start over with new parts"...................sounds like rule three  to me,........................good luck.........nies

[skip1930]

As said heat is necessary to flow the lubricant.
Less then 160 deg F. is nice. That's about as much as anyone can touch and keep a hand on the hot surface.
Like a black car on a hot sunny day.

As long as you don't loose lubricant any temperature is O.K.
moderated, Skip

skip.

[Citroen/Dave]

Problem Solved!!!!

The bearing buddy for some reason seated against the bearing of my left wheel causing it to "over tighten" the bearing.  My mechanic found the problem after he re assembled the hub for a fifth time.  

If he had spun the wheel after he had driven the bearing buddy in, he would have noticed the increase drag on the bearings. [He always checks after securing the bearings.] Same hammer force on the other bearing buddy did not cause over tightening of the right wheel bearing.  

Moral of the story:  Check wheel rotation and wobble AFTER driving the bearing buddy in.

Now back to working on the boat before the next launch.

[nies]

Gald its fixed..................nies

[Bob23]

Very interesting. I'll admit I never check for drag after the BB is installed. Never until now. Thanks. This has been quite a case for Columbo.
Bob23

[MacGyver]

Outstanding!
Odd though, I never saw that coming in to play, and to be honest, I have never not spun the bearings after assembly even after putting the bearing buddy on..... but still a thing to think. I guess it would be good to grease the bearings, spin the hub, then install BBs then respin to check for same "feel".

Thanks for posting the issue and repair!

Mac