CDI FF1 on CP16

[jamato323]

I've decided to put a 140 genoa on an CDI FF! to easy both sail handling and trips to the bow underway. I had hoped to use a Johnson type tensioner similar to that in the "Mastender" systems Com_Pac uses on its newer sloops and cat boats. But CDI says that won't work with their system as the drum must go over the turnbuckle. My question is how can I increase tension on the forestay after using a clevis or pushpin to secure the mast? Keep in mind I've benefited from Social Security for some years now and both dexterity and strength are on the ebb
Many thanks.

[wes]

Jamato - I adjust forestay tension indirectly by adjusting backstay tension at the turnbuckle on the transom (I have a 19). I imagine you would do the same for the 16, yes?

Wes

[Salty19]

No backstay on the 16's.

I believe you'll simply lift up the furler a few inches to adjust the turnbuckle.  However I don't use a CDI but rather a Harken so wait for a reply from someone who has the CDI for the right answer.  In fact I had to cut the Harken foil a precise length to allow for this lift. 

[sailen69]

jamato
I use a quick release tensioner on the head stay of my CP-16.  It saves time and fielding around at the ramp and it helps me keep consistent rig setting tension.  I thought that if I added a CDI FF to my boat I would try using a standard turnbuckle on the head stay and try the quick release tensioner on one of the side stays.  Once I have the rig tuned and pined where I wanted it, I could ease the tensioner on the side stay to slack the head stay with furler.  That would give me enough slack to pin and un-pin the head stay and not have to fiddle with the turnbuckle under the furler drum.  I use a CDI FF2 on a bigger boat.  There is not enough room under the drum for a quick release tensioner.  I use a quick release tensioner on the back stay of that boat.  I don't have an adjustable back stay on that boat.  It works for me like I described above.  
Rich

[jamato323]

Thanks Sailen, trying to figure out your method...how does the loosening of tension on the side stays make the forestay more slack for pinning? Interested as I haven't solved this problem yet.

[sailen69]

The main idea is that the standing rigging on a Com-Pac 16 that supports the mast consists of three stays, the head stay and two side stays that run slightly aft of the mast.  I think most people have a bolt at the base of their mast that connects the mast to the tabernacle, mast step.

Make sure that the base of the mast is bolted but free to move as if raising or lowering the mast when making adjustments to the stays.  When you make an adjustment to one stay, it affects the other two.  If you tighten up the port stay turnbuckle, it will pull the mast to the port aft and increase the tension on the other stays also.  If you loosen the tension on that port turnbuckle, it will allow the mast to move forward and slightly starboard and ease the tension on the other two stays also.

With the quick release opened, but still pined to the chain plate, the other two stays will go slack.  The mast may shift slightly to one side and a little forward as the tension is eased on the side stay.  This will give some slack to the head stay so that you can easily remove the pin from the chain plate and then lower the mast to the stern.
 
My CP-16 is in my front yard at the moment.  If I can get the time tomorrow I will try and set up my rig and take pictures.  I don't have a furler on that boat but I will try it out for my own curiosity and find out how it works.  May be it will work well and may be not so good.  I will post again as soon as I can.

[jamato323]

Brilliant! As soon as these thunder clouds pass, I'll drag "Bel" out of the garage and test the theory but sounds like their is a Johnson stay tensioner in my future. Thanks.

[sailen69]

Jamato,
Wow!  You got chocolate in my peanut butter!  I think we came up with something great.  I tried my stay tensioner out on one of the side stays and used a standard turnbuckle on the head stay.  It worked very well.  I think I will keep my tensioner on the side stay even though I don't have a furler on this boat... yet.  
It was too dark to take photos when I got home late from work today.  I think I will install my CDI FF2 drum onto the CP-16 head stay and try to take some photos of the whole set up for you.  I have to go out of town this weekend so it may be Monday when I can update this post.
That is a nice photo and a great looking boat!
Rich

[jamato323]

Many thanks, Rich. I think you've solved my problem. Ordered the FF! and 135 genoa yesterday. She is a great looking boat....for an older girl she shows her age well.
I have applied for a special Florida "antique" registration which allows me to skip annual reg. fees.
Thanks again, look forward to the pics.

[jamato323]

Tried out roll reefing on main today....still sailing the driveway but getting closer to water every day.

[Pacman]

The Florida Antique registration is a great thing!

Our old boats qualify and the only cost is the annual filing fee, just over $5.00.

The Antique sticker is good looking too.

[sailen69]

Ok here are some photos that I hope will help show the general idea with a description.  It is worth mentioning a few things about using a tensioner / quick release lever like this.

1.  It is handy to have the quick pins on a lanyard so they can't get dropped or lost.  

2.  The cotter pin or cotter ring used to secure an open turnbuckle will not work with this set up to keep the tensioner from spinning on the shroud stud.  

3.  I use a nut on the shroud stud as a jam nut to lock the tensioner turnbuckle adjustment in place.

4.  Make all adjustments to your standing rigging as if starting from scratch to set your rig how you want it.

5.  Pay close attention when setting this up for proper tension.  This device uses mechanical advantage to pull tension on the rig when closing the lever.  It can be very easy to put excessive tension and load on you rig.  

I use this quick release  because of the ease of operation, no tools needed at the boat ramp, my rig tune is already set where I want it, and the time saved to rig up and take down.  




This is my side stay with the original turnbuckle removed and a nut put on the stud.


My pins are secured with a stainless steel lanyard to keep them handy and from getting lost.


Install and adjust the quick release on the shroud stud.


Attach the quick release to the chain plate with pin.  Tighten the jam nut on shroud stud after final adjustments to rig tune.


I use the end of my topping lift and loop it around my bow cleat when I raise and lower my mast to hold the rig up.  This gives me two hands to work with and I can move anywhere I need to pin or un-pin the head stay.


This is the head stay with the original turnbuckle installed.  Your CDI FF will have a cup and drum installed over the lower stud and cover up the turnbuckle.  You will be able to slide the drum up to make adjustments to the turnbuckle and install cotter pins.  There will not be enough room for the quick release.  It is nice to not have to mess with all that once it is set up other than routine inspection.  You can see that with the quick release lever attached and open that I have about three inches of slack to work with.  


Easy to pin and un-pin the turnbuckle with this kind of slack and the rig is temporarily held up with the topping lift looped on my bow cleat.  


Release the topping lift from the bow cleat and close the quick release lever.


Insert the pin.  


I cover the whole setup to keep anything from fouling up or getting pulled loose.  


The head stay is pined and the rig is tuned.

[jamato323]

Hey Rich:
What is the make and model of the tensioner you installed on your 16. A got a close look at it on your Photobucket and their appears to be a hole in the clevis pin through which you secure the swagged end of the side stay....correct? That's what I need. I have the CS Johnson tensioner which doesn't have that.
Great pictures.
Thanks

[Pacman]

Tried out roll reefing on main today....still sailing the driveway but getting closer to water every day.

Roller furling on the main sail:

Please tell us about it.

[Shawn]

Pacman,

It is built right in. Just pull the boom toward you and you should be able to rotate it to roll the sail onto the boom. My Flying Scot was the same way though it was a pain due to the sorta mid boom sheeting it used.

Shawn