Honda 2 HP: Long or Short Shaft - External Fuel Tank Ideas

[mikew]

Pacman, I found a great blog of how a Honda 2 HP OB powered West Wight potter makes it almost around the Great Loop., from the Illinois river south to Florida, then north to NJ coast.  Buzz uses an external tank to refuel the  Honda's tank. He explains how he  made it on his site. There is also a you tube video of this. I don't own a Honda but just passing this on :
http://thedalamar.com/?p=2664
if the link doesn't work go to site  www.thedalamar.com, on the right side archive section look for August 2010, scroll to Aug. 27
( continue reading). The you tube video is on Aug 27 , or search for:   filling the gas tank callie312
I think this trip of about 4000 miles? so far says alot about these outboards. ( he had no sails, only motoring).
Mike
 

[Pacman]

Mikew,

Thanks for that link. 

My first design concept is similar to his set up on the feed side.  However, instead of allowing fuel to spill from the open vent when the tank reaches full, I was planning to close the vent and use a clear return line to send the excess fuel back to the external tank.

Now I know that my first design concept will work but I still want to try the second iteration which uses fuel tank vacuum to draw fuel from the external tank.

If that doesn't work, I can get a squeeze bulb and a second line to follow the first design with a return line.

[Salty19]

Thinking about the gas tank issue, I would try the following:  acquire a marine tank and matching hose with fittings and bulb.  Doesn't have be a Honda.
then acquire the matching hose fitting for the outboard end (same brand as the tank and line) and mount it on the outboard case securely, line end facing inwards towards engine. A custom bracket will almost certainly be needed.  Replace fuel hose from onboard tank to carb with a new hose from fitting to carb (or extend the old line if it will reach). That would mimic a stock setup.  You could potentially install the new outboard fitting via a T splice with one way diaphragms to use either external or internal tank.  That's how an old Johnson 4hp I used a while back was setup. At least I *THINK* there was a diaphragm there.

I do like how Yamaha tanks and lines are designed.  Didn't like the Tohatsu design much, the line would pop off all the time and the tank was flimsy.  It was actually a Nissan branded setup, but they are made by Tohatsu.

The half way around the loop with a 2hp is kinda misleading.  Note he went downriver.  No way a 2hp motor can fight a strong river current upstream.  If the current is flowing at 5 knots, the boat will not move upriver, even with a much larger motor.

[Pacman]

Tried my new motor for the first time today.  SWEET!

It pushes the boat just fine at between 1/3 and 1/2 throttle.

No problem with fouling the mainsheet when in the up and tilted position.

My modified motor mount raised the powerhead enough so the tiller handle clears the transom with room to spare when in the down position yet the prop is well submerged.

I am very happy with my new motor choice.

Thanks

[racer129]

Salty 19 speaks with wisdom. The Honda 2 hp was mounted on a glorified dinghy (Potter 15) going downstream. I sail in open water on Lake Erie in four to five foot chop using a 4 hp two stroke and that can feel inadequate in certain conditions. Bill

[sailen69]

Packman,
Just another idea I have seen out their for an external fuel tank modification.  Search it online or try this link:  http://homepage.mac.com/storm_boy/iblog/LearningtheRopes/C1642073231/E20060808165218/index.html
I think the fuel cap idea looks easier.  I do like to close the fuel supply off and the cap vent when I have the motor razed up and out of the water. It sounds like you like to tinker a little from your other posts.  I hope you take some photos on your project for us to see and good luck. 
Good Sailing,
Rich.

[Pacman]

Here on the Gulf of Mexico if there is much of a chop, there will almost always be enough wind to sail.    

The only strong currents are in the passes during times of maximum tidal flow.  Those can be avoided by consulting the tide tables and planning accordingly.

The main reason for having the motor here is that sometimes the wind dies and goes calm.  On flat water the 2HP is just fine.

The Great Lakes are something else altogether.  I remember seeing rough water but no wind on Lake Superior.  The waves must have come a long way from the east and then stacked up on the reef and got all confused.  Also, on the big lakes the waves can be quite close together.  The Great Lakes are not for the faint of heart.

[kickingbug1]

     the sailors here who have met me know that i swear by (not at mind you) a 1969 cruise and carry (no foolin). its aircooled, lightweight, ugly and load and best of all i got two of them for free. i carry the other one on the port side bunk area for a spare. but if and when they fail the honda two horse will be the replacement.

[Salty19]

I admit, I've given kicknbug some friendly ribbing for his "chitty-chitty bang-bang" cruise and carry.  But you cannot argue with cheap, reliable and effective. 

It's really a shame they don't make something like them anymore.

[kickingbug1]

one added benefit if you can call it that is everyone either asks "what is it?" or "what year is it". kinda like that 52 ford, which by the way is on the road. pictures coming

[Salty19]

FYI, there is a clearance sale at Defender on generic fuel lines with bulbs  $10.  They need fittings.

http://www.defender.com/product.jsp?path=-1%7C311%7C302335%7C314209&id=1558866

[Pacman]

Salty19,

I just ordered one, along with a new bow light.  Good pricing on both.

Thanks for the tip.

[Shawn]

"It's really a shame they don't make something like them anymore. "

The Cruise and Carries are a little harder to find but Sears sold zillions of their Tanaka made Gamefisher outboards. They made a direct drive 1.2hp that is about 13 pounds, a 1.75hp model that was around 18pounds and a 3hp model that weighed about 24pounds. The 1.2 can't swivel around for reverse but the 1.75 and 3hp models both do. The 1.75 could come direct drive or with a centrifugal clutch and I think all the 3hp models had the centrifugal clutch. Unless you are going for maximum portability I'd avoid the 1.2 simply because it can't spin for reverse.

I had a smaller Cruise and Carry and have had all of the Tanaka/Gamefisher models and still have the 3hp model. 

Shawn

[Shawn]

If you try the vacuum feed idea make sure you test it out on the water away from any potentially dangerous situation. You don't want to find out the hard way that trying to pull the fuel is too heavy and you end up preventing fuel feed into the carb and having the engine stall out. Be sure you test it at low RPM for awhile and then again at high RPM.

Shawn

[Salty19]

Vacuum feed seems like a bad idea to me.  I predict it will stall due to fuel starvation.   On all the outboards I've had, whenever I forgot to release the fuel tank vent, the motor would run for a little while, then loose power and die. Every vehicle I've had was vented...even chainsaws and weedwackers have vent diaphragms.   I vote to vent the tank and pressurize with the fuel bulb.   I could be wrong about your plan Pacman, so if you've got a solid plan in mind, try it.