Rudder carrier refinishing / teardown

[buckaroo]

Decided to refinish my rudder and tiller, as the years outside have not been kind - lots of superficial corrosion.  On the big cast aluminum rudder carrier, though, there's a jam cleat at the top that will need to be replaced (the UV took its toll) which I can't figure out how to remove. It seems to be riveted in rather that screwed/bolted.  Any ideas on how to remove the cleat?  Or for attaching the replacement?  I don't like the idea of drilling out the "rivets," but I may end up doing that.

Regarding refinishing, my plan is to sand or otherwise remove the existing paint/corrosion, then prime with zinc chromate, following up with a black satin marine paint.  Sound like a good idea?

[skip1930]

Drill the rivets out. That's how they went in from the factory. Rivets.
But the jam cleat ought to be OK if it was in fresh water. I'd not give too much hope for salt.
Is the whole aluminum casting off the transom?
Glass bead it, de-gas it, powder coat it with an epoxy-polyester p-coat.
Look around your area for a company that might have a powder coat line or be in the business of p-coating.
Talk to the night shift guy, slip him a couple of bucks, or buy pizza for the crew.
Once you have that done drill out the pinion holes and put in some brass oil-tight shoulder bushings, back to back.
I have a few picks from a month ago showing the job done on my CP-19, Comfort & Joy.

Take a look~see at these here.  

#48   General Com-Pac and Sailing Related Discussions / Boat and Hardware Modification / Re: Play in Rudder at wheel  on: March 09, 2011, 12:09:27 PM  

skip.

[buckaroo]

The jam cleat will work, it's just ugly from years of UV exposure so I'd like to replace it.  I like your idea of powdercoating (your rudder looks great), but I want to use a process that will allow me to do the other piece in situ, leaving it on the boat.  I want to avoid tempting the gods by pulling it off and creating the possibility of water incursion into the transom.  Plus, it's a PITA that I'd rather not deal with right now, as I've got a couple of concurrent projects going on the boat that I need to finish before she goes into the water later this spring.  She'll be trailered when I'm not sailing, so will painting be adequate (though maybe not ideal?)

Guess I'll need to buy a rivet gun for the cleat... unless someone can think of a a better way to attach it?

[skip1930]

Drill out the rivets, and use a self tapping screw, like a TEC screw, with a hex head. Be careful to NOT break off the hex head, or there will be heck to pay as these things are hardened. Use a couple to make the threads, and then a new one to hold the jam. I actually don't jam anymore as my blade is hold fully down with a snowblower shear bolt. So no kick-up.

skip.

[KPL]

I didn't have a cleat on my boat (1982) so I mounted a spinlock powercleat on the aft end off the tiller (stainless wood screws).  The line goes through the cleat and to a small shackle through the hole in the rear of the rudder blade.

Just a thought.
Kevin

[wes]

Just went through this whole process myself. The rudder jam cleat on my 1988 CP 19/3 was a Sea-Dog CL203 "clam cleat." Still available from West Marine or Defender (better price). I went to www.sea-dog.com and verified the dimensions (rivet hole spacing) before ordering, just to make sure.

- We

[buckaroo]

Wes, did you use rivets, Skip's self-tapping screws, or Kevin's screw-into-tiller approach?  Did you paint or powdercoat the aluminum?  How'd it turn out?

[wes]

My rudder (1988) had a lot of slop from worn bolt holes. So I first I had a buddy with a machine shop drill those out using a very long bit (to maintain alignment) and press in a set of bronze bushings. Learned that idea from previous postings elsewhere on this site. Result is outstanding - very precise rudder movement, no slop at all. Then I had the aluminum parts powder coated at a local shop. This has proved frustrating due to pits and bubbles in the finish due to outgassing. They blasted my parts down to bare aluminum twice, and tried powder coating at various temperatures and also using a primer formulated for outgassing, but the results were never very good. For the moment I'm going to live with the situation; the rudder still looks 100% better than previously. I've since done a good bit of Google research and learned more about the  outgassing problem with cast aluminum. There are several strategies such as pre-baking prior to coating that I'm not sure my local guys were aware of. My suggestion is that you do some reading yourself, and interrogate your powder coater to find out if they are knowledgable.

I have not yet re-mounted my clam cleat. My intention is to drill out the rivet holes, tap, and use brass or SS machine screws with Lok-Tite. I'm a drill-and-tap kind of guy; don't like the idea of self-tapping screws or rivets after I've gone to all this trouble to rebuild the rudder.

Many weekend hours have been spent stripping and refinishing my original tiller too. I think time spent on the rudder and tiller assembly is one of those  renovation projects that yield both performance and appearance improvements in equal measure. I was fortunate that the previous owner had already upgraded to a foil rudder. If he hadn't, that would have absolutely been at the top of my list.


- Wes 

[buckaroo]

After some time spent with citristrip, aluminum jelly, and sandpaper, I've now cleaned up my rudder head pretty well.  Trouble is, I'm kinda digging the bare-metal look.  Any reason that I HAVE to paint/pcoat it?  Will it corrode to nothing if I leave it bare?  I don't intend to keep in in the water...

[skip1930]

If you like the way brushed cast aluminum looks with no protection or finish, why not just clear coat the aluminum casting with a couple of coats of brush-on single component polyurethane. Flat, semi, or gloss. I would not do this if it were in salt though. Also a few coats of Mother's automotive wax over the polyurethane wouldn't hurt. The wax will leave a little 'white' in the low spots of the casting. Do not use clear coat epoxy, it's not very UV resistant unless it's an epoxy-polyester blended coating.

My rudder casting is hammer tone coated grey epoxy-polyester powder coat after a five stage heated, power spray wash and conversion wash with DI rinse and degassing and a complete cool down. P-coat only at ambient temperature to keep the mil-build as thin as possible or around 5 to 8 mils. Should be set for 20 seasons here in Wisconsin or maybe three seasons in Florida.

The rudder casting is bushed top and bottom. No slop.

skip.

[Bob23]

Buck:
   I don't know if your'e in salt water or not. If so, paint it. I primed mine with zinc chromate primer after a nice acetone wash down, and painted it with Bronze hammer finish Rustoleum. So far, so good. I like the bronze look- similiar to the bronze color of the cleats.
Bob23

[buckaroo]

Ha! Great minds think alike.  I bought a couple of rattle-cans of Rustoleum hammered finish stuff a few weeks ago for this very purpose.  Same color, even.  I was a little concerned about how it would hold up in a salt water environment -- how's yours so far?