Can jib/genny hanks be removed?

[rdcvsmith]

Since i will be primarily sailing my CP19 ('83 #109) alone I will be seriously considering installing a roller furling this spring. I've been doing some reading/research/etc. I could resort to paying a rigging guy at the marina to install one but if I can figure it out alone (and if it can be done by a novice) saving a buck is always a good thing. (provided I do it right)

I'm assuming one can use their gib or jenny they already have and modify it for a roller (?) (or do I really need to have a custom foresail made)

I have brass hanks "pressed" on going through a grommet and over the luft tape of both my gib and genny now.
Since I believe the luft tape needs to be threaded into a "channel" in the roller "foil" (trying to use the right terms here ?) the hanks need to be removed ....right

Can I take pliers and a screwdriver and pry them off or is this a special deal where I need to meet my local sail maker/repair person and have them do it for me?

-Ray

[Billy]

good question as I too have a hanked on Jib and would one day like to upgrade to a roller. I have new sails and would hate to have to replace a brand new sail.

Billy

[peterg]

Yes, you can convert a hank-on jib to roller furling configuration. A couple years ago, I purchased a new and unused hank-on Precision 18 jib off of eBay for fifty bucks. The dimensions were very close to the dimensional specs for my then Compac 19. I removed the hanks by prying them open from the grommets. Next, order up some #6 luff tape from Sailrite. In this instance, I sewed the luff tape to the sail luff without removing the grommets or luff wire, and it worked perfectly fine, but a lot of attention has to be paid to keeping the sail and luff tape at even tensions when sewing together. The correct procedure would be to remove the grommets and the luff wire, sew on the luff tape, and sew loops on the tack and head of the sail. This allows for proper luff tensioning when the sail is hoisted. A heavy duty sewing machine is a must. Have fun..............

[newt]

Although it can be  done, you also need to sew in a sacrificial layer so you can keep your roller-furler jib up during the season. I would recommend someone who sews to do the whole thing for you. You may also want to change the shape of the jib, or put foam in it to keep its shape when partially furled.
Of course, if your willing to buy the books and machine and devote the time you can do it! There are a number of books that I would recommend it you decide to go that route. I did and I do not regret it.

[rdcvsmith]

Keep comments coming ....but already I'm thinking this may not be a "do it yourself" project!

My backup option to ease solo sailing is to lead the halyards aft (currently I just have the basic cleats on bottom of mast), and also maybe instal a downhaul for the foresail (several post have spoken highly of this if I stay with the hanked on jibs). (this also sounds like a chepaer route for now).

I know a lot of you swear by the ease of your roller furlers so you have me thinking....

[peterg]

Newt is absolutely correct in advising the addition of UV protection for the sail when it is furled. On the last one that I sewed up, I left the sacrificial layer off to save weight on the leech and foot and made up a zippered Sunbrella sock that was hoisted up with the spinnaker halyard  around the furled sail when I was docked. The sail performed a little better in light air without the couple pounds of added Sunbrella, though there are lighter fabrics that can be substituted if you don't go the sock route. Also, you don't need to spend a fortune for a Sailrite sewing machine. I've used an old Pfaff machine that I picked up on eBay for very little bucks, and it had a walking foot and zig-zag capabilities and served very well for non-production work. There are a million of the old black Singers out there that will darned near sew through aluminum, and they are real precise marvels of early American manufacturing. I had a real old Singer 220C that I used for pennant work- the quality of the machine is almost unmatched today, and I got it for sixty dollars at a yard sale, then sold it to a collector for three hundred. Everyone with a boat should learn to sew!!

[newt]

That is a good idea about the Sock Peter, how easy is it to put on the jib in heavy air? I like being able to roll it in quickly when the wind picks up, but I would also like a larger jib (for lighter air). Eventually I am going exotic with a staysail and a baby stay.  That will make the boat even more versatile.

[peterg]

Hi Newt- the sock goes on quite easily in any wind, as long as you are anchored or at the dock. It has a full length zipper and you merely hold the zipper slide as you hoist the sock and the furled sail is very effectively protected from UV and the elements. The bottom had a loop sewn on to secure it when the hoisting halyard was tensioned. Looked good and worked great.  Give a lot of thought to that proposed cutter rig before you go ahead and install it- we always called them "clutter rigs" because they are more trouble than they are worth on boats under about 38'. On smaller boats it is almost impossible to tack cleanly in under 20+ knots, as the jib almost always jams in the relatively small slot between the inner and outer forestays. For general daysailing or weekend trips, I usually pulled the inner forestay back and secured it to the base of the mast so that tacking the jib did not turn into a project. When going on longer offshore trips, I re-attached the inner forestay and self-tacking staysail in preparation for whatever conditions arose. There were times when the wind was sustained 35-38 knots with higher gusts and big seas, and a double reefed main and staysail (with furled jib) made it seem like a stroll in the park. This was on the heavy displacement Pacific Seacraft Orion 27, "Green In Between", that my wife and I cruised for ten years.




Green In Between heading to Catalina Island

[Billy]

There is a guy a few slips down at teh marina w/ a 25' Voyager. Beautiful cutter, but he NEVER uses the stay sail unless he is on a long voyage just like Peter mentioned. and only when above a close reach.

[newt]

I the problem is the lakes I sail on here in Utah. The have very bad weather. It can go from dead still to 60 knts in an hour. I am looking for a little more  ability from my little boat, as sometimes I am the only boat (and only dry spot) for 10 miles in diameter. I love my big cutter (a Valiant) and just trying to recreate a few of the virtures in my little boat.
Otherwise I agree with you. The babystay can be a PITA.  of course I will make mine removable.

[Bob23]

Pedro:
   If I get a new jiob, I'll go with your sock idea. I'll be a-pickin' yer brain about this. If it helps, I'll bring my friend Hose over to your house. I don't know if you two have met.
  That is one beautiful ship, Pedro. On another subject, I think I may be getting cp-27 itis. Can you recommend a cure?
Bob23

[peterg]

Hey Bob- I'm the doctor and i got the cure...................buy my CP27!!!  I found the last in a total of  fourteen Cape Dory 24 trawlers manufactured and am lusting after it..........I need some moola!!!  Aaaaarghhhh- boat fever strikes again!!

[Billy]

Boat fever, tell me about it! I just bought a 8' walker bay on a whim! it only cost $75 though.

[Salty19]

Ray, I'll be going through the same thing this spring.

Have a homemade furler now, upgrading to a Harken.   The reason for this is, because of the design of the homemade furler, I was only able to use 1 sail on the unit.  That is a 110% jib as the 155% was too long with the spool at the bottom.  Fine for most conditions, but too often I want a lot more sail up than that.

Since the furlers need luff tape. I either need to send the sails in to be customized with luff tape and hanks removed or just buy new sails ('cuz I ain't tackling sail repair just yet, know it won't come out right and no HD sewing machine!).  I think I'll buy new and will sell my old, or donate one as a door prize for the Carlyle Lake Rendezvous and sell the other.

In your case, ..either have the sails redone for a furler or buy new sails or tackle it yourself.

The tricky part of this equation is you need to be real sure of your new luff measurements when ordering a new sail or sending your old ones off to be recut.  
All your sails will have the same luff to fit the new furler.  In the case of a storm jib, and maybe even a 100% jib, the sail loft may make a pendant at the top, essentially some rope and a ring at the top of the luff to reach the furler shackle.  So with this said, you won't have sail measurements until you've built, fitted, adjusted and installed the furler so wait until you're done with the install before ordering anything.  Best to get the dimensions exactly right instead of guessing.

[Bob23]

Pedro:
   That's not the cure I was hoping for. But, what are you gonna ask for your 27? I know..this is how it all starts, doesn't it?
   Lemme know when your'e back in NJ. Maybe we can discuss this over some Tequila and chili!
Bob23
...and now back to our regularly schuduled program.