flotation on the cp16

[ALEXANDER]

 Does the 16 have enough positive flotation to keep it afloat if it is swamped?  I know that there is some flotation under the bunks and in the foward section, but is it enough to keep it afloat if the boat is holed and fills with water?  Is there some suggested (or standard) way to add floation and if so, how much should be added?  Thanks for the help.
HAPPY HOLIDAYS TO EVERYONE IN COMPACVILLE!
Alex

[mrb]

Alex,

Do you have the large block of foam under the cockpit between the berths.  There has been discusion on this matter in the past and I don't know if the question has ever been answered.

[Tim Gardner]

The 16, 19,23,25,27&35s will all sink if filled with water.  Positive flotation was not required by any authority for these vessels.

TG

[kickingbug1]

   tim is right keep the hatchboard in in heavy weather. but it would take quite a blow to knock one down i expect. undersailed as they are.

[ALEXANDER]

Thanks for the information guys,
Any idea where I might get a large block of foam...and how much flotation needed to keep a 16 above water?
Alex

[curtisv]

Thanks for the information guys,
Any idea where I might get a large block of foam...and how much flotation needed to keep a 16 above water?
Alex

A lot.  Fresh water weighs 60 lbs per cubic foot.  Salt water is 64.

A CP16 weighs 1300 lbs (I think).  So figure on adding more than 20 cubic feet of foam, 25-30 if you wanted to be really on the safe side.  You can't get a block big enough but you can buy foam that can be poured into some area that you've set aside for buoyancy.

Maybe you should just keep the water on the outside of the boat and forget filling her with foam.

Curtis

[ALEXANDER]

I think I'll take your advice and keep the water on the outside.
My concern stems from an incident that occurred on a trip to the keys several years ago.   Off of Miami we were holed when we hit a refrigerator!   It was partially submerged so we did not see it until it was too late.  We were able to motor the boat (an Endever 32) to the city dock for costly repairs.  Not a pleasent experience.

Al

[curtisv]

Al,

I can see where an experience like that would make you want to add flotation.  It is doable and I've considered it for my CP23 for the same reason.  For a cautious sailor who watches the weather carefully, there are few things that could cause a sinking, but floating large debris is one of them.

There is a lot of room under the cockpit but adding foam there would cut down on storage.  There is room under each bunk and in the forepeak under the v-berth.  Some foam could be added along the hull sides taking up mostly unused space due to the curve of the topsides.  Add it all up and you could find enough volume but it would be a lot of work and costly.

Curtis

[Salty19]

Alex,

See your concern but note that a.) Compacs are extremely tough boats and are not known to get holed  b.) at 5 knots the impact will be relatively minor.

I would spend the money on a good waterproof VHF and PFD instead, and as mentioned keep the hatches in and secure the lazerette hatch if you have one.

If you do go with your plan, keep the foam way up high.  If water gets in there, the foam will want to be at the top, so low placed foam may keep the boat from sinking, but turtled and potentially tough to right.  I kinda picture the idea of turning the boat upside down and pouring foam underneath the topsides for even distribution??

Put any new hardware on and reseal what you've got first because it will be darn difficult to do so after the fact.

Still I think it's not necessary but think things through real good if you do go for it.

[sailen69]

Alex,
I sailed Hobie Cats, Sunfish, and ran row boats and canoes when I was a kid.  The best part of a hot summer day was to flip them over and give the boat and crew a good soak to cool off.  It was also to teach the crew how hard or easy it was to swamp and un-swamp the boat.  They also learned just what to expect and what to do for those unplanned things.  All those boats had positive floatation to keep them from going to the bottom.  I love to sail my CP-16 in all weather and I have put the rub rail in the water from time to time when the wind kicks up.  I have found my courage (or lack of concern) higher when single handing and have wondered what volume of displacement would be needed for positive flotation for the 16.  I thought about the idea of using water ballast bags inflated with air, placed in the bow, under the seats, and maybe secured from shifting.  They would not be a permanent alteration to the boat and could be removed if I needed the space.  I wear my PFD when sailing alone, working the rigging, and when the wind is kicking up.  I like the idea of keeping the water on the outside the best, and giving Mother Nature her due respect.  I still think that adding some floatation for an added precaution is a good idea if you can afford the space and the cost.  Those ballast bags are pricy.  Just a thought....  Good and Safe sailing!
Rich

[ALEXANDER]

Curtisv, Salty 19 and Sailen69,
Thank you all for sharing all your experiences and knowledge.  It is all very good and sound advice.  I'll wear my PDF, try a little flotation and of course keep the board up and the water out!  You guys are the best!
HAPPY NEW YEAR!

[curtisv]

Al,

I have heard of boats sunk hitting a corner of a not quite sunken shipping container.  It is very rare, not quite as rare as getting hit by lightning on a golf course.

If a vessel is holed, anything short of enough floatation will still be a sinking.

When I priced the cost of floatation for a CP23, the price of the pour in foam alone was about $500 plus any fiberglass and resin to frame out areas to hold foam.  I decided against it.

If you don't add enough to float the holed boat, you might as well save yourself the cost and the trouble of adding any foam at all.

Curtis