I WANT A CP23!!

[Lee]

We do not own a CP23 at this time but intend to buy one soon. (Anybody want to sell?) Whle we have enjoyed our Catalina 22 for years, I think the family would enjoy and appreciate the CP23 much more. I am searching the market for a good 1980s era CP23 and will be interested in any general shopping advice folks may have. I also have several questions and will appreciate any answers y'all might give to some or all of them:
      
1.    How well does she perform in light air?
2.    How well does she perform upwind?
3.    What are the more common maintenance problems?
4.    There is no compression post under the mast; how much trouble does this cause with deck compression?
5.    Is the keel/hull joint a big maintenance problem?
6.    One advantage with our Catalina 22 is the availability of a large aftermarket for parts and supplies. Does the CP23 enjoy such good OEM support?
7.    What is the gross trailer weight for a typical CP23?
8.    How big an outboard do most people use?
9.    Is there a good source (internet or otherwise) for specs and construction/design details for the various versions of this model?

Lots of questions, I know. Thanks for any helpful responses!!

[trapp]

Hi Lee,
I recently purchased a CP 23/2 (#346) and I've been very happy with it.  My personal experience so far is that upwind performance is not great.  This is a trade off for the shoal draft and not having to worry about maintaining a swing keel.  To the best of my knowledge the hull is one piece and then cement is poured in to provide ballast so there is no hull/keel joining.  As far as deck compression around the mast goes, my CP is almost 20 years old and I have no cracks in the gel coat or sponginess/soft spots around the mast base.  The deck in that area is very thick and seems to be well reinforced.  My CP came with a Yamaha 4-stroke 9.9 horse and I'm very happy with it, I don't think I would want any less than that.  For parts, com-pac is still in business and I've had good results being able to drive to the factory and pick up parts when I need them.  You can get a list of available spare parts from the Hutchins company but will probably have to deal with shipping.  I haven't had any major problems with my CP, there are no through-hulls below the waterline to worry about, no swing keel to fuss with and the systems are simple and easy to work on.  If you want to spend more time sailing and less time fixing then I think the CP23 is the boat for you.  Good luck.

[CaptK]

1. How well does she perform in light air?

Pretty well, depending on your sails. I have a 150 genoa that goes up when the wind is under 15 (and sometimes when it's over). According to PHRF ratings, the CP23 is a "cruiser/racer", which sucks when you are racing, but is OK when you are sailing. She's heavy enough that once she's moving, she'll ghost through lulls.

2. How well does she perform upwind?

In my experience, due to the shoal keel, the key to making ground upwind is to keep heeling to a minimum. I won't heel her beyond 15 degrees when working to windward. The condition of your sails probably makes a bigger diference on a CP23 than it does on a boat with a deeper keel, also and relatively. I try to keep her heeled no more than 10-12 degrees, and shorten sail in order to do this. She's not a star upwind, but she'll do. It's a trade-off - I've outrun larger boats upwind just by being able to sail farther out of the channel, or over flats, lessening the number of tacks needed, that sort of thing.

3. What are the more common maintenance problems?

I'd say that nothing beyond normal maintenance is needed, and perhaps less, due to the solid fiberglass construction (no coring - yay!).

4. There is no compression post under the mast; how much trouble does this cause with deck compression?

I have a slight flatness under the mast - perhaps 1/4". On the CP23, the main bulkhead acts as a compression member.

5.    Is the keel/hull joint a big maintenance problem?

Not applicable - as noted above, the ballast is encapsulated.

8.    How big an outboard do most people use?

My CP23 has an inboard, 12hp. This engine came out of a CP27, and is plenty. Your choice of horespower will have a lot to do with where you sail. I am a bay/ocean sailor - at times, it's really nice to have that power in reserve. On a lake, a trolling motor would suffice to get out to where the wind was. I think most people I've read of use from 6-10 hp.

9.    Is there a good source (internet or otherwise) for specs and construction/design details for the various versions of this model?

Construction hasn't changed much, since the addition of the bowsprit since the CP23/2 in '81 IIRC. Since then, mostly it's been refining an otherwise great little boat. I haven't yet transferred the specs page here to the Forum, but you can see it at CP23 Specs Page

Good luck on your hunt, Lee!

[Lee]

My thanks to both of you for the thorough responses; you have been very helpful. Perhaps soon I will be a CP23 owner.

[jaguaretype]

Lee, my 1990 23D is at Brady Mountain on Lake Ouachita.  E-mail me at marsh-economic@sbcglobal.net if you want to check the boat out.  Com-Pacs, and in particular the 23, are great boats.  Jay Marsh.

[Lee]

Seems a good idea.
My lake is just a few hours from your lake.
Will email you for directions.

[miata]

We do not own a CP23 at this time but intend to buy one soon. (Anybody want to sell?) Whle we have enjoyed our Catalina 22 for years, I think the family would enjoy and appreciate the CP23 much more. I am searching the market for a good 1980s era CP23 and will be interested in any general shopping advice folks may have. I also have several questions and will appreciate any answers y'all might give to some or all of them:
      
1.    How well does she perform in light air?
2.    How well does she perform upwind?
3.    What are the more common maintenance problems?
4.    There is no compression post under the mast; how much trouble does this cause with deck compression?
5.    Is the keel/hull joint a big maintenance problem?
6.    One advantage with our Catalina 22 is the availability of a large aftermarket for parts and supplies. Does the CP23 enjoy such good OEM support?
7.    What is the gross trailer weight for a typical CP23?
8.    How big an outboard do most people use?
9.    Is there a good source (internet or otherwise) for specs and construction/design details for the various versions of this model?

Lots of questions, I know. Thanks for any helpful responses!!

I have a 1983 and love it. I was not looking for a com-pac but could not find a good price on a Cape Dory 22. The 23 does not have a wooden core so that is worth the price of the boat in future repairs.

I bought a new 5 hp briggs and straton 4 cycle engine for 750.00 and it has a 2 year warrantee and any shop that sells their mowers can work on it. It is the best engine ever made in my opinion and it has pushed my boat against a 25 knot wind at near near hull speed.

Back to the boat; it is stable and safe, as I sail in the winter in NC when the temp is 50 or above and the boat remain in the water all year. The boat is easy to trailer. I pulled mine 300 miles partly up hill with a small 4 cylinder Ram truck with no problems at all. I do not suggest that to you as it may not pull the boat out of the water but do not plan to pull the boat in the near future. The boat has as much space and storage as a 23 needs. I must admit the 23 is not a hot rod but I don't race and it does not matter if I am going a half of a knot faster up wind or pointing 5 degrees higher up wind. The 23 is a small ship not a big boat. I like sailing more than core repair which is a potential problem with most other boats. National will make a main for the 23 for 420.00 which is cheaper than most used sails. A jenny is about the same.
I have owned 2 great and very fast catalinas but it's hard to ever miss a center board when you have a keel that works in shallow water. The catalina is most likely a little faster but I never trusted it in the winter as it may not recover from a knock down like the Com-Pac so I always pulled it during the winter and I missed a lot of good winter sailing.
A 23 is hard to find used so good luck I bought the one one I remember seeing and it had been brought in from the Bahamas which means some one has more guts than me. It speaks highly for the boat in any event.
The boat has a 13 hundred or better keel and the boat is a about 3000 pounds. The trailer vary due to material.

[CaptK]

A 23 is hard to find used so good luck I bought the one one I remember seeing and it had been brought in from the Bahamas which means some one has more guts than me. It speaks highly for the boat in any event.

John -

Did you buy that boat in Murrells Inlet, SC? Probably, because of the Bahamas story - that boat was one I looked at, and was very interested in buying before I bought my 23D, "Epiphany". Glad to know she has a good home and new owner - every time I drove past her in the past 2 years I've wanted to "rescue" her.

[miata]

It is the same boat. We did a ton of work on her and she is a fine boat. I have sailed most of my life and I am 52,  she is a great boat and I am proud to own her. She is in the piedmont on High Rock, lake ,NC in a cove and I think she looks at home. I went to Lowes and got pool chase lounge cushions hald price for the quarter berths and they fit fine and both cost 50.00 total.

I spent 6 full days buffing the hull and she came back to life with a little wax. I got her with a great trailer for $2,900 and put in another 2,000.00 including the new engine and I have never seen that much boat for the money.

[CaptK]

Hah! That's great. When I looked at her, the guy wanted $5,000!!! No way - she was too neglected for that. Then earlier this year she went to a dealers yard on Hwy 17, and I watched her there for a couple of months, I guess until you bought her. Just this morning, coming back from my brothers house in Litchfield, I wondered who had bought her as I drove by that lot. Glad that she has a new home, and an appreciative owner. Glad that you got a better trailer! The one that she was on when I was looking at her was scary.

As an aside, I've a bit of history with High Rock Lake. A friend and I paddled kayaks starting from North Wilkesboro, NC, down the Yadkin/Pee Dee until we got to Georgetown, actually pulling our boats out at the marina where my boat is now, about 400 miles. This was back in '93, I think. We had a good time, and that is a beautiful lake. It was the first of the big lakes we paddled across. After staying the night on the peninsula between the North and South Forks of the Yadkin at Salisbury, we started that morning and were down to the dam by late in the afternoon. What a portage! That was were we figured out to rappel the boats down to the river with rope, instead of toting them by hand. We finished the portage with enough light to eat dinner, then paddled across Tuckertown after dark, stopping for the night on the other side of it's dam around midnight. I've always wanted to go back up there and look around some more.

[miata]

I talked earlier about the Briggs and Straton engine. I forgot it is a short shaft and the motor mount had to be lowered. The engine is as I see it is the best buy on the market. It is not water cooled and needs no water pump.
I did want to mention it is not warranteed for salt water.
Miata

[Lee]

Miata--
Have you found the Com-Pac 23 more tender than the Catalina 22?

I have sailed both fin and swing Catalina 22s but have never sailed a shoal keel of any sort.  Even though the cp23 is heavier and carries more ballast, I wonder if her shoal keel makes her more tender than the c22.  

I will appreciate any comparison in this regard between the c22 and the cp23. Thanks.
--Lee

[miata]

The CP is not tender at all. I sailed mine today and had frost on the sail cover. I love Catalinas and have owned 2 but I would not sail one in the winter as they do not have the weight to take a hard gust and recover without a knock down and rounding up when the rudder comes out of the water. My CP keel weighs about 13 or 14 hundred pounds no Catalina I have sailed had that kind if ballast.

The Catalina is fast and fun to sail or even race but I always pulled mine in the winter. I do not plan to pull the CP 23 unless I need to paint the bottom in 3 or 4 years.

I have sailed my 23 CP in 25 knots with gust in the thirties with a reef in the main and a small jib. All the other boats went in and some warned me that it was too rough out there. I told them I had a sailboat and they need and like wind. The didn't see the keel.

I had a rudder cut that is 14 inches longer than the standard and made a sharp leading edge and rounded off the hard corners.

I hope this helps; again the catalna is a wonderful but I like to sail in the winter.
Miata

[twilson]

I have a beautiful 23 that has a very lonely life.  I have maintained her, but not let her out of her little cage near enough.  She is an '81 model with a 2000 Honda 4 stroke 8hp.  Original interior in wonderful shape. 2 sets of sails, the new set only used 3 times. New bottom coat and all neccessities to take on coastal voyages. She is docked in Little River,SC and she does not have wheels of her own.  I am very willing to negotiate selling her.

[miata]

I have friends who want to buy my 23 but it is not for sale. Give me an idea of what you want and I'll help you sell it. I may even buy it and re-sale it or donate it to a youth group at my church who want to learn to sail. I have a trailer and can move it if sold in a reasonable distance. I am in Lexington, NC but grew up in Lumberton, NC. I have spent years on the SC coast.

miata