Garelick swim ladder

[mr.jadkowski]

Had a little "incident" last weekend that illuminated my need for a swim ladder on my 16. I've seen a lot of references to the Garelick "2-step" ladder, but I'm finding two different models of Garelick 2-step transom ladders! Which one is it?

Ladder #1: https://www.iboats.com/shop/garelick-2-step-compact-transom-ladder.html

Ladder #2: https://www.iboats.com/shop/garelick-2-step-compact-stainless-steel-transom-ladder.html

Ladder #1 seems the closest to the Hutchins ladder. #2 has a smaller mounting footprint and is stainless, has no handrails, and probably wouldn't go as deep into the water as #1

[Salty19]

I had the 2 step on my old 16.  Worked fine, but a 3 step would be A LOT easier to board.  If you're heavyset, out of shape or have bad knees--get the 3 step!

[mr.jadkowski]

I had the 2 step on my old 16.  Worked fine, but a 3 step would be A LOT easier to board.  If you're heavyset, out of shape or have bad knees--get the 3 step!

Which 2-step model did you have?

[Salty19]

We had the the ladder #1 you have shown. 

[mr.jadkowski]

We had the the ladder #1 you have shown.

Thanks!

[kickingbug1]

have a three step on my Catalina 18. get the three step.

[SMOKEY]

Hi. I too would recommend the 3 or even 4 step as being a lot easier to use especially in unplanned situation, i.e.; fully clothed ( and soaking wet) cold water, uncooperative wind and waves, and especially single handed. I ordered and installed the Hutchins ladder and it looks good but I have yet to use it.

[Mas]

Hi. I too would recommend the 3 or even 4 step as being a lot easier to use especially in unplanned situation, i.e.; fully clothed ( and soaking wet) cold water, uncooperative wind and waves, and especially single handed. I ordered and installed the Hutchins ladder and it looks good but I have yet to use it.

yup, have a cracked rib and found (usually haul myself over the cockpit combing but can't with the rib issue), after i purposefully jumped overboard at anchor, that i struggled to even use the factory ladder with our 16. A stern push pit would have made it much easier as good help to haul myself up. Not much to grab otherwise. Def avoid the little ladder!

[mr.jadkowski]

I found another option, the Garelick four-step telescoping transom ladder: http://www.garelick.com/EEz-In=Telescoping-Transom-Ladder It's similar to #2 in my original post, except that it telescopes to 34" long. It also has an integrated catch on the mount to keep it in the retracted position, and slants away from the boat in the down position which might make boarding a little easier. My only concern is that the mounting footprint is pretty small; four bolt holes in a 2x2 configuration that are relatively close together. There is also a 3-step version for $40 less, but they are almost exactly the same dimensions when collapsed so I see no reason not to get the 4 step.

I'm leaning towards this one, as it seems to offer the maximum amount of ladder in the most compact package, with the easiest deployment and stowing, and the least amount of drilling. Do any of you have any concerns with the mounting brackets?

[Mas]

Looks like an easier ladder to climb. I would be a little concerned about only top mounting brackets. The factory provided ladder brackets mount in 3 places thus distributing the weight better on the transom. Definatly would use backing plates.

[JTMeissner]

I put a lot of thought into getting a ladder for my CP-16 when I had it all apart...  I was previously using a ladder with hooks that was just hooked over the side whenever we wanted to swim.  Of course, not ideal if it was sitting in the cabin and you went over by yourself.  Getting back into the boat without a ladder (and without stern rails) would have been nigh impossible.  Pretty sure it would have involved locking the rudder up and trying use it as a step up the tiller assembly.

So, besides having a ladder that gets deep enough for one to climb, there's the issue of it being small enough for the 16's transom.  Consider both height and width, both factors in the transom space, and when folded (if possible) and not.  Also think about where you will step up over the transom.  Now that I have stern rails, the only reasonable space was to come up between the starboard rail and starboard mainsheet block, which is a matter of inches (more space for those without rails).  Factor in weight for crew in the back of the boat while sailing (on each tack) and whether dragging parts of the ladder in the water bothers you at all.  The transom curves in both planes; finding level does mean the ladder does not line up with the lines of the boat.  And finally, remember when you attempt to climb the ladder, the boat will tip to that side - I wanted it as close to the centerline as possible to mitigate tilt, but can't interfere with the rudder.  Another factor for me was I didn't want the folded ladder above the top deck because it would interfere with my stern light mounted on the starboard side.  This did mean the ladder does not go as deep as a longer ladder might as the folded ladder had to remain below transom top.

After plenty of contemplation, I went with a fairly small ladder (skinny, 6" wide steps).  http://a.co/1Q7GDWv  This only has bolts at the top, but then has supports/offsets near the first step (I thickened the transom with the same backing board at that point).  A possibility for those who may need the lowest rung to be lower in the water is to use a loop of rope off the bottom rung to create a rope step that floats high enough to find in the water but then can be stepped on to get the next foot to the first hard rung.  It also serves as a pull rope to bring the ladder down from the water... now that I am thinking of it, I will probably do this.

What I don't have is a great picture showing the stern... perhaps I can add later.  What I can share right now is the backing board I made while refitting the boat (3/4" plywood, holes are cut to lighten the board and allow it to flex and be epoxied in place along the curve).  The second photo is then the interior of the transom, showing all the holes through the back of the boat.  All through bolts have pretty good sized fender washers as well (like the motor mount).  Third shot is the ladder mounted, which does show that while folded, the ladder is above the scupper holes, so generally stays out of the water regardless of weight/tack and is below the transom top. 

I have yet to test the system to return from the water.  The clip is secure (trailering didn't loosen it), but I believe it could be pulled down from the water (hard yank).  While sailing, the ladder stays out of the water.  If the rudder is lifted up, it can turn an hit the bottom of the ladder (extreme angle, so I keep the rudder centered while in the slip), but while down, no interference regardless of tiller angle.  And a final note, it could have been mounted lower, then a strap used to lift the ladder into a horizontal position since it can tilt in the top mount, sorta folding twice.  The lower section is longer than the top, so couldn't go all the way... I may try that in the slip which would mean the rudder couldn't hit the ladder ever.

Just my thoughts.
-Justin

[mr.jadkowski]

Thanks for the pictures JT. I was also looking at that ladder, since it is the cheapest and most compact one available. I also like that it doesn't require drilling holes near the waterline. If you get a chance, do you think you could post a picture with the ladder unfolded to see how far down below the waterline it goes? Also, a slightly wider shot of it on the stern would be nice to get a size reference.

I'm thinking that the right move for the telescoping stainless ladder would be to add metal backing plates on the inside of the transom, and ply shims underneath the brackets on the outside of the transom. The metal on the inside would distribute the force well, and the ply on the outside would protect the gelcoat and fiberglass from getting creased and crushed by the bottom edge of the bracket when the ladder is loaded up.

[NateD]

I installed a ladder like JT's on my Dolphin 24. My guess is that it is the same ladder, but I bought mine from Five Oceans. Because of the shape of the transom on the Dolphin I couldn't use the lower legs and had to rig up something more solid with bimini parts, but that obviously isn't an issue on the CP16. I used some 1/2" ply backing plates (coated in epoxy). My family and I were out sailing/swimming this weekend. The ladder is a little narrow, but we had no problem using it. The plastic clip did keep it up while sailing/trailering, and it is easy to pull down, even from the water. Since it is pretty cheap I don't know how well it would hold up to constant salt water exposure, but for fresh water I think it is going to be good. I weigh 195 pounds.

[JTMeissner]

I grabbed some photos since I was able to be up in the area today.

First one shows the ladder stowed as it rides in the slip.  Second photo shows the ladder in the down position.  I'd guess that the bottom rung was down about where the bottom of the transom was, about 4-5 inches into the water.  However, when I then stepped into the boat in order to have my weight near the stern (remember, you'd be hanging from it), the ladder went down 10 inches, or a full rung.  Finally, I looked at what would happen if I lifted the ladder, and in my case, the rungs then rest against the rub rail and are clear of the rudder.

As installed, I would venture that coming into the boat means I step up between the mainsheet block and stern rail. 

-Justin

[mr.jadkowski]

I ended up going with this ladder: https://www.wholesalemarine.com/garelick-telescoping-3-step-transom-ladder/

I measured out the size of the four-step telescoping ladder and it's HUGE. Like, longer than the rudder huge. The three step should still go 15-20" into the water, which is plenty for me. I thought about that little Amarine ladder again (I actually ordered it and then immediately cancelled the order), but I think it's just a little too short. I also realized that the Amarine ladder has basically the same mounting footprint and stresses as the Garelick telescoping ladder, so if that one is OK then the Garelick ladder should be fine. Since I'm drilling into the transom, I figure I should just get something that I know will be easy to use instead of taking a chance on something that may or may not be too small.

I'm still nervous about drilling into the transom near the waterline, but I'm not the first one to do it so if everyone else has pulled it off I bet I can too.