water in the bilge

[archimedes]

I am looking at a CP 23.   But discovered several inches of water in the bilge.   Not sure how it got there since the boat has been on a trailer for months.

The boat does have two through hulls,  but since it hasn't been in the water for so long I'm not sure that's where the water is coming from.

Anyone get water in their bilge just from rain?  Any way to check if a thru hull is leaking while on the trailer

[alsantini]

I am really not CP23 capable, but a boat is a boat generally....  with that in mind, I seriously doubt that water is getting into the bilge from a thru-hull while on the trailer.  More likely would be plugged cockpit drains allowing the cockpit to fill with water draining into the cabin and then the bilge: Cabin top fittings leaking (this one I have experienced) where the rain gets into the cabin and eventually works its way into the bilge: Windows leaking in a driving rain again getting into the cabin and eventually bilge: Deck port usually over the V berth.  I do not know if the CP 23 has an anchor locker but they are pretty common causes of rain water filling the locker and draining into the cabin.  I would first look for the telltale signs of leakage around the cabin roof fittings and check lockers that have drains.  I had a Precision where the anchor drain came off and allowed gallons and gallons of water to "flow" through the cabin.  If possible try to spend some time in the cabin when it is raining or just after it has rained.  Any idea when the boat was last in the water and if it was salt water, taste the bilge water for salt.  Hope this helps.  Al

[archimedes]

Thanks Al.

The boat hasn't been in the water for quite a while - the better part of a year.  It was in salt water before, but believe me you wouldn't want to taste the water in the bilge.  It's pretty nasty.

The deck of the boat seems to be pretty tight.  I couldn't find any places, on deck, where water might be coming in.  You never can tell sometimes with water though.

The thing that is strange is that it's a lot of water, not just a little moisture - several inches.  I'm thinking that if it was water that had gotten in via the thru hulls that it would have evaporated by now. No? 

I'm not fond of thru hulls and I don't like the looks of the one on this boat,  but it's hard to believe that if it was water from the thru hulls that it wouldn't have evaporated by now.

I've looked at a lot of boats but I've never seen one with any water in the bilge, let alone this much.

The interior is really in good condition, so it's hard to imagine that the water overflowed the cockpit into the cabin.

If the cockpit filled with water, is it possible that the water would overflow into the lazarettes before going over the bridge deck?

[Mas]

Hey Archimedes, we have recently (fall 2015) purchased a CP23d with multiple thru hulls for head, sink, engine and the bilge had been pretty dry though she had lived in the water 24/7/365. She was purchased in a warm climate then moved to the Chesapeake area where she sat uncovered on her trailer till in January i noticed the ports had been leaking (new signs of this not old). Too cold to replace them so covered the entire cabin area with a heavy canvas tarp. Returned to the boat in March to begin work on her to get her in the water and discovered the bilge filled with water to the bottom of the motor mounts (she has an inboard diesel). I had removed batteries for the winter so the bilge pump cold not work. I used the manual pump to pump it out but was very surprised to have had a boat on a trailer, covered cabin, with that much water in her.

I have since replaced the port seals, all the thru hulls were off but do not see how water in any amount could get in thru those anyway while on trailer. Ran water thru cockpit scuppers to check them and they seemed fine. Anchor well seemed to be fine, and frankly it still remains a mystery. Some items in the lazarettes seemed damp while everywhere else forward was dry. It sits on a slight tilt to facilitate the water draining. Boats do shift when not in the water and shift yet again when returned. It is why on engine replacements they usually will never do the final shaft alignment until in the water again. She also sat uncovered in a cold climate for the first time and cold weather has a way of opening up those avenues for moisture. Since it is not your boat yet not sure how easy it would be for you to do what Alsantini suggested, but have someone run a hose starting at the stern (if tilted to the stern which it should be) and work their way forward ruining water over every fitting, hatches and all areas (use lots of water) while you sit below looking for (take a flashlight) and feeling for leaks. Many boats will take on some water in storage from the elements especially as they age. Ours is is a 1990. It also was instructive for us to keep the auto bilge pump in working condition even while on trailer.

I hope the story of ours has helped with thoughts about the 23 you are considering.

[Tim Gardner]

Brett, you may want to check the cockpit drains connection through the transom.  Many of our boats have sprung leaks at the little pvc pipe  at that point.  Rain water that would enter the drain may be getting shorted to your bilge there.
$.02

[Bob23]

Brett:
   I'll expand on Tim's answer, with interest on his 2 cents. I also discovered more water in the bilge of my 1985 23/2 this winter. First year I didn't cover her. I traced down the leaks to the PVC pipes where they connect to the cockpit floor under the fuel tank area. Apparently whatever sealant that was there at one time, was not there anymore. I scraped the crud out with a Stanley knife, wiped everything down with acetone and hand applied some old 4200 that I had lying around. After a few days it rained and voila! no more water from those sources but I still have a tiny bit in the bilge. There are lots of places for water to enter: stern rail that needs to be resealed, hull/deck joint that could be open somewhere, headsail tracks....etc, etc, etc.
   But I'd say my fix cured 95% of my leaks. Have fun!!!
Bob23

[Mas]

ok so now i am doubting I checked my scuppers well enough. Ran water from a hose in the cockpit and both looked and felt along the scupper lines and didn't feel or see anything but maybe i should have been more patient? Ran the water for a minute or two. The piping has an covering over it that has been painted in the same color as bilge. That sound like most?

[Bob23]

I plugged up the scuppers with large corks, filled the drains and felt around underneath. Make sure it's dry down there before you start. I could feel and see the drops so I was able to detect where the leak originated.
Sherlock 23

[archimedes]

Thanks for the feedback fellas.

It occurred to me that there was a cockpit table in the cabin.  I meant to examine the area where it connects to the cockpit  floor,  but I forgot to.  The cockpit had one of those teak floor grates and I forgot to look under it - it slipped my mind.  I suppose that could be an entry point too.  There was a decent amount of debris in the cockpit so it seems like the cockpit/cockpit drain is a likely entry point.

However,  I have never been very fond of thru hulls,  it's one of the reasons I like the CP23.  I'd hate to put the boat in the water and then find out the water is coming in thru them.  Or worse, find the boat resting on the bottom 24 hours later.

If I do get the boat, I think I'll just find someone to replace them just to be safe.

How difficult of a job is that to do?  Anyone know? 

[Mas]

Ok, the stock 23 with no marine head, no diesel, should have zero below water thru hulls right? The sink will have an above water drain. If you do have thru hulls, we have multiple for transducers, diesel water intake, raw water wash intake, marine head intake and flush, then they should only be the approved type for boats and have backing plates (preferably fiberglassed plates). To have them done professionally is not cheap but then again so is having a boat sink. Regardless i am confident that the water you have did not come from them (if you even have any) if on the trailer.

The cockpit grate does not attach anywhere so doubt it caused any issues other that trapping dirt and debris. So the table actually fastened to the cockpit floor? Anywhere there is a hole, water can find it's way. Your best bet if you wanna know for sure is to completely pump and dry out the bilge and then as mentioned sit inside while someone starts at the stern and floods all areas with water. A lot of it!

What year is she? Age gives you good prices and guaranteed aging issues, so as long as you understand the trade off you can make a better decision.

[Jim23]

I find water in the bilge of my 23 every spring. I dry it out and it remains dry through the summer. It took awhile for me to figure out that snow was filling the channel around the cockpit hatches. Melting snow in the cockpit would overflow the hatch lip and run in to the bilge, usually 2-3 inches deep.

[Mas]

Hey Jim, that was our belief, though we had water to the bottom of the diesel motor mounts. That a lot of snow and ice melt, but we did have both and very heavy rains not long after a hard freeze. We will have to see. Al pervious owners report completely dry bilge other than the occasional stuffing box drip till tightened. This was her first year ever sitting naked out in the cold with snow and ice. Maybe we should buy her some clothes!

[Bob23]

Arch:
  Install an electric bilge pump and sleep at night. Anywhere a screw or bolt penetrates the deck, cabintop or cockpit floor is an opportunity for water to enter. I usually have a little in my bilge. I worry not about it. Next fall I will reseal the entire hull to deck seam and rebed everything. Until then, I sail.
Bob23

[Mas]

Arch:
  Install an electric bilge pump and sleep at night. Anywhere a screw or bolt penetrates the deck, cabintop or cockpit floor is an opportunity for water to enter. I usually have a little in my bilge. I worry not about it. Next fall I will reseal the entire hull to deck seam and rebed everything. Until then, I sail.
Bob23

and leave the batteries hooked up. I removed mine for the winter and found that electric bilge pumps are not real good when no electricity! (though as mentioned she has never had water in her bilge before.) Time for a small solar charger i guess. We will be hauling every year so no shore power available. Good news out of all of this was confirming the electric pump works and finding a problem with the manual bilge pump. The uptake hose had worked it's way against the drive shaft on the motor and it had been completely worn away. Duck tape to rescue until i could replace the hose and tie it off. Best to find this out on a trailer and not taking on water at sea.