Okie Engineering

[OkieBob]

Okay, here is a history of what were dealing with.  I love sailboats.  I have loved sailboats all my life, and occassionally had the chance to spend time on somebody elses boat, which I deeply appreciated.  Last summer I finally decided that I wasn't just dreaming anymore, and I bought an ole CP-16.  I have read a lot, but I don't know what I'm doing, although I am enjoying ever minute of it.  I respect these guys that refurb old cars, but I never was interested enough myself to put that much effort into a car.  Well the boat is different, and I plan to pimp my ride, and I hope you guys provide plenty of comment along the way.

Some things I'm seriously considering are:

TRAILER MODIFICATIONS - Modify trailer to fit in my 20' garage.  Most if not all of the trailer modifications are done.  They include adding a swing to the tongue; relocating leaf springs below the axle to lower boat level; and a removable tongue extension for when on the ramp.

LEAD BALLAST - Replacing some concrete in the ballast with lead.  I like the idea of less wasted space. [Already received some fine feedback on that, and am reconsidering whether to do it.  Probably will, but need to reassess the final objective.]

BOWSPRIT - Adding a fairly long bowsprit.  I like the look of bowsprits, especially the old timey wooden looking ones, but my garage will not accomodate any more LOA, so it needs to be removable.

ROLLER FURLERING JIB - Do it youself design.  Thanks for the tips I have already received.

SAIL AREA - Increasing the sail area.  I'd like to increase the above the waterline height at the top of the mast, before replacing my old sails.  That plus the bowsprit/forestay change would add more overall sail area.

WATERTIGHT CABIN - I need to make the boat more watertight in the event of a capsize.

COCKPIT ENCLOSURE - Add a removable enclosure that can function as a bimini and possibly a dodger, as well as a cockpit tent depending on which pieces are connected.

Well that is the majority of the plans so far.

[Salty19]

Wow, you have quite a list there!!! May I add a IDA or homemade foiled rudder?  You won't be sorry.

What about a tilting/hinged bowsprit? That way you can bolt it well to the "superstructure"..lol   When needed, tilt down, attach bobstay and forestay with mast/furler. Easier than unbolting?

Thought you would like to see this pic.  Doug142 on this forum made the spool for me.  The rest I made out of PVC using the instructions you've probably seen with some minor modification.



For sail area, since you're going to need a new forestay anyway for the bowsprit, you could raise the rigging to be 7/8 or near masthead rigged and fit your genoa to match the added lenght.  Maybe a 200% genoa?  But be aware your bow pulpit maybe too short.  You'll want to at least think about the possibility that you may have to extend the bow pulpit for the forestay to reach a long bowsprit.


Good luck and we're all waiting to see and hear about your project!

[OkieBob]

Salty,

Beautiful spool!  Is that wood?  What kind?  Is that pic from the 16 or 19?  Thanks for the great tips.

[Salty19]

It's made out of solid Mahagony with Cetol Natural Teak coating and about 4-5 layers of Minwax helmsman Spar Urethane Varnish.  It matches the rest of the teak pretty well actually.  The interior of the drum is various widths of PVC tubing as is the spar to fit the sail. Ping Doug142 on this forum to see if he'll make one for you at a small price. His workmanship is excellent! (it would not look that good if I tried to make it it!)

The boat is a 1982 CP16/I. 

[kickingbug1]

   my furler has a welded aluminum spool and single piece pvc foil. e mail me and ill send you some pics

[Craig Weis]

Cool my furler is solid Harken.
Outrageously expensive. Glad the first owner, Lloyd, had the dealer, Yacht Works, install the Harken size '00'.
Unfortunately Lloyde's wife died and he never got this boat wet.
Having lost a crew member, Lloyd purchased a new Sun Cat in dark blue. I bought Lloyde's boat.

skip.

[kchunk]

Is the Com-Pac 16 a fractional rig? If it is and you wanted to add a bowsprit you could size the bowsprit so that the angle of the new fore stay would match the angle of the original fore stay but would run from the masthead to the tip of the bowsprit. Leave the original forestay (now an inner stay) and you would have a cutter rig of sorts. There probably wouldn't be enough of a "slot" between stays for it to be an effective cutter rig, but you could perhaps use the new fore stay for a little clipper sail or on light wind days you can fly a larger genoa, or a small stay sail on the inner stay and a large genoa on a furler on the new fore stay.... yeah, I like that! It looks real good in my mind 

...the bobstay to the bow eye, maybe a couple bow sprit shrouds for good measure. If you support your new bowsprit adequately with stays and shrouds, you should have no issue with a hinge on your sprit to swing it out of the way when you're stuffing her back in the garage.  Hmmm... I like it a lot!

--Greg

[Salty19]

kchunk-that slot between foreshrouds would only be able 1.5' wide. Original rigging is 3/4.  Not enough for a jib to pass over it when tacking. But I like the creativity!

Skip-yep the harken furler you have it probably the best one out there.  They are quite pricey if you've ever looked them up!

[kchunk]

I dunno Salty. I think it will work great. I'm getting my inspiration from a Newport Venture 23. My buddy has one. Granted a bigger boat, but the idea will certainly work. Here's a web site I found. This is not my friend's boat, but it's the same thing:

http://www.hbrhealthcare.com/vn23wow/vn23wow.htm

Here are a few sample images:

The bowsprit is attached atop the deck:




Inner stay at the same location of the original fore stay and new fore stay at the end of the bowsprit with bobstay to the bow eye:




Both stays terminate pretty close together up the mast:




In the case of the Com-Pac, terminating the new fore stay closer to the masthead and maybe even taking the bowsprit out a foot and a half or even a bit more will both increase the sail area and help with the crazy weather helm of the little 16 without a bowsprit. And not to mention, probably make it the best looking Com-Pac 16 around.

One drawback, like you said, tacking will be different...not impossible, not difficult for that matter, but different. If you were to opt for the small yankee jib (like seen on the Newport Venture), that little sail will go through the slot no problem. If you opted for a larger genoa, you'd probably need a roller furler and have to reef the genoa a bit before tacking. On a small lake where you'd be tacking quite a bit, that might be an issue, but for bay or coastal cruising where you could spend all day on a single tack, that big genny would be perfect.

This summer my family and I cruised from Key Largo to Marathon, FL over a 3-day period. We sailed a port tack the whole way down...three days without tacking!  lol 

--Greg

[nies]

I think it would work. I will measure my bowspirit, but I am sure it is at least 15 , if not enough , could add a extension on front of bowspirit to gain more room between two stays. The real problem may come from moving the "out" stay up the mast . Stress may be greater than the mast can take, currently all three stays meet at the same area thus countering or balancing/canceling each other out .....going up to the garage to measure.......Phil

[kchunk]

Phil, The mast should be fine as long as it's equally supported by the standing rigging...BUT! You brought up a good point. I forgot the 16 doesn't have an aft stay...does it? I guess this mod will require an aft stay in addition. I suppose that's no too much of a big deal. The new fore and aft stays don't have to be heavy because they're just "auxiliary" rigging of sorts and not really required to support the mast as the mast is supported just fine by it's original rigging. But now we're adding the weight of two stays and the sail "up there" as Skip would say. Personally, I don't think it would be too much of an issue but I'm sure there will be others who'll disagree.

Maybe perform this mod concurrent with the lead ballast mod and the increased force of the lead will balance the increase weight aloft of the new rigging...lol 

--Greg

[Salty19]

Interesting conversation.  It will be fun to see what you come up with, Okie!!   

[nies]

Greg, haven't been to the garage, I am not concerned about the weight, but the bending or breaking of the mast between the stays at the top of the mast, old people worry a lot....Phil

[OkieBob]

You guys are giving me some good ideas.  Also I went to the link Greg posted; they did a lot of work to that Venture; great pics.

I really like the length of that bowsprit.  I have two conflicting goals, but looking at this picture, those goals may not conflict at all.  One, I would like a pretty long bowsprit.  Two, if the sprit gets too long, the foresail may end-up being too far forward screwing up the boat's balance.  After seeing these photo's, I realized (the obvious) that the forestay can be placed anywhere along the sprit, it doesn't necessarilly need to be placed at the end.  So I could have my cake and eat it too.

I doubt I'm coordinated enough to handle two foresails, although it does appear to be an option.

[kchunk]

Actually, Bob, I think the extra sail forward will help to balance the boat which is already off balance, i.e. excessive weather helm.

And I've sailed on a Newport Venture...managing the extra sail is nothing...and besides, it'll be such a cute little sail on a 16, how possibly could it be unmanageable?