The continuing adventures of Koinonia

[Bob23]

   I still use a Davis self-steering thingy in my tiller. Doesn't do a great job self-steering but works ok as a tiller lock- like when you're raising sails.
   I have not converted to loose footed main yet, although in the wasted days of my wayward youth, I was pretty foot-loose. Another story for another time. I have the slug, just haven't gotten around to it yet. I need to get a jump on some of the varnishing. Normally, this is winter project time but last winter I blew off all those jobs and, thus, got a late start. I did make a great slide out chart table where the sink used to be.
   Back to the rudder. Yesterday I was able to tack through 100 degrees....with just the main! With the jib she'll do at least 90 degrees. Pretty good, I think, considering that these 23's are not known for pointing that high. While reading an article on rudders during dinner, I wondered if anyone has converted a 23 to a blade rudder forward of the transom. You know, built around a shaft through a sleeve that comes up into the cockpit itself. Not that I'm gonna do it. I think it would produce a terrible lee helm.
    It aint easy when your mind races at such high speeds like ours do. It seems to get mere mortals upset.
Bob23

[Salty19]

90 degrees ain't too shabby!  That's about where Island Time is close hauled.  It seems almost tighter than that though, based on the direction of the cassette tape streaming off the shrouds. Then again that is apparent wind and I'm not the best at judging this.  But with the main up only, I don't think I'm pointing to 100 degrees.  More like 110 as a guess, and you have to work it to get it there.  It will fall way off on tack w/ mainsail only, requiring some time and careful trimming to make any upwind progress. My sails are in pretty good shape.

I had (still have in a drawer) the Davis tiller tamer.  Hated it. Line always in the way. Also not easy or fast to quickly loosen it.  There are plenty of shifting winds here and it caught me by surprise a time or two on the 16.  I'm using the forespar extension but have yet to mount the coaming boxes.  For now I just let it rest against the crockpit bench on the leeward side when I need to let go for a moment or three. Works fine if you take a few seconds to fine tune it.  Then with steady winds and a broad reach, it will sail itself for quite some time (until winds shift or the need to tack). That may not work as well when raising the halyard..guess I'll give it a try next time the admiral stays home.

Moving to loose footed this week. I just needed this part, item # 601164
from defender for $2.57 which arrived.  Will use 1/8 Amsteel line (very high strength) to fasten to the clew.

[newt]

Bob, your making me very jealous of your exploits. I will make a foil rudder my first priority after haulout...

[brackish]

For now I just let it rest against the crockpit bench on the leeward side when I need to let go for a moment or three.

That's what I do.  drop the ball on the bench.  I'm sure the coaming boxes because they lock in both directions work better, but I've been able to get by this way and decided not to get them.  I have a Davis tiller tamer, brand new, never installed, came with the boat, PO didn't install it because it would not let them use the tiller cover.  I'm not planning to install.  I have a Raymarine ST-1000 for when I need more time.  Used it a lot on BEER.  Well worth the investment, particularly if you single hand a lot.

I'm also going to loose footed.  Looking at blocks to get the outhaul easily adjustable this morning.  Becket to the block on the sail clew, back to the block on the boom and back to the cleat seems to be the right formula for me.  Another opportunity for a double braid eysplice.

LOL, crockpit is now an official CPYOA term.

[Salty19]

I wondered if anyone has converted a 23 to a blade rudder forward of the transom. You know, built around a shaft through a sleeve that comes up into the cockpit itself. Not that I'm gonna do it. I think it would produce a terrible lee helm.

A neighbor slip boat, a mid-70's Chrysler 22 or 23 has this setup.  Looks painfully ackward, it's right where your knees and legs will be.   It's in pretty nice shape for being so old, and a nice couple owns it, but even the admiral commented on how awful the tiller layout was. Dare I say a wheel would be better?

Brack--take a look at Harkens' website.  There is a .pdf catalog to download.  Within the first few pages are a diagram on a nice 4:1 outhaul system with camcleat for quick adjustment.  Will be putting this on hopefully before the Carlyle Rendezvous.

[Bob23]

Newt:
   While it is true that I haven't learned how to post photos here, I do have the technology to email pictures of the rudder building project to you or any of the other Compac scallywags that might be reading this. While, previously, this was highly classified information, recently it has been made available to the public. Let me know, I can download the photos into a crockpit file.
Salt:
   Yes, while I was writing that, I remembered how intrusive those tiller-in-the-crockpit arrangements can be. May I be forgiven? I don't really love the Davis either, but it's there so there it shall remain.
   To all: I'm still convinced that if I can move more of the rudder body forward, I can further lessen the weather helm and thus attain even higher speeds. Remember, when I fabricated the down haul, I moved the rudder pivot point back 5/8" thus theoretically contributing to weather helm. But much more of the blade is forward so the helm is much more balanced than the original
   Am I splitting hairs here?   
Bob23

[newt]

When I saw the "crockpit" I thought OH *#%$ its broken again, and I started going back into the innards of the forum. The next post kept me from going very far. VERY FUNNY guys! Although crockpit does describe the area i navigate from when sailing....You know, the area where all the sheets go to and that ornery old crock is on the tiller...

[Bob23]

Sorry, Newt. We do appreciate all the work you are doing for the site so the rest of us freeloaders can have a place to hang out.
Bob23

[Salty19]

Yes, while I was writing that, I remembered how intrusive those tiller-in-the-crockpit arrangements can be. May I be forgiven? I don't really love the Davis either, but it's there so there it shall remain.

Of course...thinking outside the box is an area I enjoy wandering in and feel a very important attribute to have.    Otherwise we would all be sailing mini-ships with wooden blocks and hemp sheets!

Will you forgive me for using (soon) a very short tiller?  When the rudder is truly balanced there is very little effort to maintain control. Even in stronger winds.  At least that's my experience with the IDA.  So why have the extra length in the way all the time?  out of the box...

[Bob23]

Good point,  Mike:
   If you don't need a long lever, why not use a short one? Maybe I'll toy around with that one on my boat sometime. It does make sense.  My friend Dennis (1970 Morgan 30) has an extremely long tiller on his boat, on a shaft that enters the cockpit near the rear. This boat has an almost neutral helm so the 4 foot tiller really gets in the way sometimes.
   My only reason for staying stock is that I use a tiller extension sometimes when alone and a shorter tiller would not allow me to sit as far forward as I can now.
Bob23

[Bob23]

To all:
   There is no great news on the Koinonia front. She weathered the fierce Hurrican Earl well other than a horrible scratch from a protruding nail in the dock that was meant to protect her. Damn...I hate that. I have had more damage from docks and pilings than anything else...so glad I'm on a mooring.
   There are a few cruises planned for the fast approaching fall here in NJ. We get more than our  fair share of North winds and clear, dry weather. The changing colors of the mainland deciduous
trees stand in contrast to the pines and cedars so sailing here in the fall is very colorful. The reflection off the seemingly darker bay waters is absolutely stunning. Also, lots less traffic as most of the tourists have returned to thier home states.
Bob23...more later...

[newt]

That is interesting what you say about a Dock. I am thinking about putting up a few moorings myself, esp. for my larger boat. It seems you can sail away easier and there is a lot less temptation for others to "borrow" things off your boat. Of course a disadvantage is convenience, but it seems you can overcome that with just good seamanship. (rowing out, cleaning her when you are at a courtesy dock, etc.)

[Bob23]

   That's exactly how I get to her...row my Walker Bay 8. A big plus to being on a mooring is to be able to sail on and off...it really helps build boat handling skill- I've only motored off once this summer and on twice.
   Sailing into an opposing current and going about 1 knot, it once took me 20 tacks to go about 500 feet...but, being the stubborn guido that I am, I was determined. Of course, there will always be those who will just start the motor and be in way ahead of me. But I did it anyway.
   As far as dock damage, nothing major. Got the anchor hung up on a piling-twice. Applied the aforementioned scratch and got the starboard toerail caught under a fuel dock. I think that's about it.
   Another plus is that Koinonia, beautiful vessel as she it, gets to show off her figure at every sunset. She has been called "the prettiest boat in the harbor".
Bob23

[Salty19]

Well the short tiller is working out real well.  Just short enough to keep away from passenger knees and oneself when moving about.  It does force you aft somewhat but with the tiller extension it can be steered from forward in the cabin, and left along the coaming for self-steering.  The quick disconnect tiller extension is nice.   Give it a try, Bob, I think you'll like it.

Edit: meant to say can be steered from the forward in the COCKPIT, not cabin. Sorry about that.

[Bob23]

Salty:
   Just how long is your tiller? Mine does not protrude into the crocpot very much and I do have a removable and adjustable tiller extension..a Ronstan me thinks.
   On the Koinonia scene: She's still at her mooring in Surf City although some of the other boats have been pulled out. Why just yesterday I pulled the "Linda Gale" (Force 5) out and am getting her ready for her winter home on the trailer.
   Soon Koinonia will move to her fall home at Long Key Marina and strut her stuff in the Barnegat Bay. It's a chance to sail some different waters and enjoy the conveniences of a marina although I much prefer being tied to a mooring! I plan on sailing into November although last year I think I kept her in till December 1st. The main problem with that is less time for winter projects. The year before she came out in August to make room for a September rotator cuff surgery.
Bob23