sculling oar project

[curtisv]

Bob,

If "Woodwind" is chosen, I promise to split the $1000 prize with Gretchen!
Curt: It would be cool to see a video of the oar in action.
Bob23

You and Gretchen are sending me $1,000?  Wow that's great!  Thanks.

Hasn't been good rowing conditions lately.  Went out today in reported conditions of 10-15 knots with gusts to 20 knots.  That's plenty of wind to fill the sails.  The wifey went along.  It was her idea!  It was ... um ... amusing.  Worth another thread.

Not sure how to hold the camera and row at the same time.  Maybe I should take someone with me?

I need to get better at rowing first unless you want a video for its humor value.

Curtis

[curtisv]

Still no video yet but I did try the sculling oar again about a week ago.

My neighbor Ron reported that Pleasant Bay was flat calm and wanted to go kayaking.  I agreed but wanted to try the sculling oar first.

When we got to the beach, flat calm was gone.  The breeze had piped up to maybe 5-6 knots.

I would have preferred less wind, given that the purpose of the oar is for use if it goes dead calm.  We tried the oar anyway, casting off the mooring and attempting to head into the wind.  Once again, I had to deal with the problem that knowing which side to pull harder on to get a turn in a given direction is not instinctive.  When we were headed straight, I made slow progress.  When the wind pushed the bow off, often I'd pull the oar the wrong way and put uf further off and then loss forward progress while getting us headed into the wind.  By the time we got about 60 feet to windward I had the hang of it but Ron was wanting to go kayaking.

Turning around and heading downwind was easy.  In fact I had to row backwards to stay stationary and turn.  I headed us downwind and then circled back to windward.  By this time I had the hang of it and was mostly turning in the direction I wanted to go in.  I came up about 20 feet downwind of the mooring and brought us up to the mooring slowly but steadily.

I've figured out a few things, some of which will change the way I build the next oar.  It is more comfortable to row at a bit over waist high than chest high.  The right stop is in the middle somewhere, a bit lower than middle.  The oar had too much leverage and too much range of motion in the cockpit.  The rowing position needs to be moved aft.  Both of these are accomplished by moving the point where the oar is mounted forward on the oar.  With the temporary arrangement I now have that means sliding a knot forward.  Another thing I need is a more secure "oar lock" than the set of lines I have.  At the very least, while I'm experimenting I need to tighten things up so the "oar lock" movement takes a lot less power out of the stroke.  When I build another oar I'll put the bend further forward and make it a less radical bend.  I may make a stern pulpit mounted temporary oar lock from wood if the knot arrangement continues to not work as well as it should.  I should also not trail two kayaks off the sides or trail them far enough forward that I don't have to limit the stroke to keep from bumping one or the other.

Yesterday was a perfect day to try again, with very light winds in the 2-3 knot range occasionally dying almost completely.  Instead I took a leisurely sail.  The next two days might be OK.  Great light air sailing but maybe not light enough to play with the sculling oar.  I really need under 10 knots and preferably well under 5 knots which doesn't happen a lot around here.

I've proven to myself that if it does go dead calm, I can move the boat slowly with the sculling oar.  Right now I'm trying to improve from snails pace to a bit more reasonable speed.

Curtis

[curtisv]

Oh yeah.  One other thing.

The boom and mainsheets are a little bit in the way, but by hooking the boom to that annoying backstay hook (good for something I suppose), it is enough out of the way to row.  Standing on a cockpit seat and falling into the cockpit sole well while rowing can be a problem.  Moving the oar back shortens the stroke in the cockpit and mostly solves that.  Offsetting the oar to one side is something I'd like to try in which case it can be mounted lower and I can stand in the cockpit well.  The boom might be in the way then.  Only way to find out if it is workable is to try it.  Of course adding a traveller and mid boom sheeting would solve the boom and mainsheet problems but that project is still down a ways on the to-do-list.

Curtis

[Bob23]

Very cool, Curtis:
   I wonder if you could support the boom with a topping lift, raise it above level for head clearance and pull it off to one side, securing with 2 lines to keep it from swinging. Sounds like your project is a success.
   I like the motions of rowing. As you know, I row an Alden Ocean Shell and an Adirondack Guideboat. With either boat, the reactions to waves, wind and boat wake become almost subconscious. It's great fun and rewarding to move a vessel with just your muscle power, although I don't know how far I'd be able to row a 23. We rarely get days down here where the wind is that light.
   Congrats on a succesful project! When does my $1000.00 prize money arrive!?
Bob23

[curtisv]

Bob,

A topping lift would work.  I have a boomkicker and if you lift the boom too far up the boomkicker falls out of the slot on the boom end.  Easing the sheet (a lot) and pulling the boom to one side might also work without raising it might also work since the boomkicker keeps the boom from dropping.

So far I'd call this a partial success at best.  While the boat does move, it is very slow.  Unless improvement to my very poor rowing technique makes a lot of improvement this would fall far short of expectations.  One important goal is to be able to more gracefully get my boat to and from the boat ramp for the annual launch and retrieve if the wind doesn't cooperate.  Wouldn't you know it that the one launch where I want to try this out we have wind the whole way up The River to the ramp and we can't test it.

This morning we had some rain.  This afternoon we had the weather clear and the wind die to almost dead calm.  Too bad I was not on my boat.  I was on a safety boat at a sunfish regatta and the sunfish sailors didn't care for the almost dead air that the last few finishers experienced at what would end up being the last race.  Three races were enough.  After everyone got to the club the wind went to dead in places, barely there in others.  Would have been good to practice sculling if I were on the right body of water and wanted to head out to my boat.  (OTOH, only three miles drive to my house, so I could have gone out).

BTW- I've had some pretty good excuses to not sail in the last few days.  Not that I wouldn't rather sail than do just about anything else, but as excuses go these are unique.  I'll post in Off Topic later.

Don't worry about the prize money Bob.  I'll give you plenty of time to get the prize money together and send it my way.  No rush.

Curtis

[Bob23]

Thanks Curtis...what a guy.
   The 23 is a heavy boat to scull or row. I remember rowing my Seapearl 21. The entire boat weighed 600 lbs.  and I used 9 1/2' fir oars that were as heavy as they were strong. No problem when there was no wind or tide but go into a little of either and it was a lot of work. Fun work, but still work just the same. Without opposing wind or tide I could make about 2 to 3 knots. I bet it would have sculled just fine.
   I wonder about pedal power for the boat. With the right prop and gearing, it might be an efficient way to move a 23. I'd imagine a very large, slow turning prop. It's all in the gearing, one might say. With proper gearing, you could move a dump truck with a lawn mower engine.
   
Bob23

[curtisv]

As to that excuse to not go sailing and try the sculling oar again see http://cpyoa.geekworkshosting.com/forum/index.php?topic=6815.0.

Sunday after the regatta was maybe a good time to test the sculling oar.  After the storm front passed through we had a period of near dead calm (with patches of dead calm).  But there was this issue about the sun going down.

Curtis

[GretchenG]

Hmm, I don't think I actually signed on to Bob23's prize money suggestion!  But anyway the reports on the sculling oar project were very informative and I appreciate the follow-up.  Methinks my puny 100-lbs will not move the CP-16 at all without wind or mechanical assistance.  Back to the trolling motor idea...

[Bob23]

Au contraire... it has nothing to do with your weight...more of a leverage issue. I'm sure you could scull your 16! Remember, the 16 weighs about 1/3 of the 23!
Bob23

[newt]

I used to row my Catalina 27 (7000 lbs)We can do it. Just takes patience and the right conditions. I use my sweeps all the time- does anyone else?
BTW I am following your project with great interest Curtis.

[JTMeissner]

Oaring a 16?  First thing after purchase and in the water:


Granted, not having a boom in the way made it a bit easier.   

A good paddle is Plan C for propulsion, even a telescoping one would work okay.  Had to fight a small tidal current during this first "sail."  Before the trolling motor this was Plan B, used several times at the dock to get in and out without enough wind.  Admittedly, much easier with a second person to help steer. 

According to the Admiral, while the Captain gets the tiller 99% of the time, under these conditions, I'm the engine...  Can't wait for the deckhands to get older.

-Justin

[curtisv]

Hmm, I don't think I actually signed on to Bob23's prize money suggestion!  But anyway the reports on the sculling oar project were very informative and I appreciate the follow-up.  Methinks my puny 100-lbs will not move the CP-16 at all without wind or mechanical assistance.  Back to the trolling motor idea...

In one of the Lin and Larry Pardy book Larry talks about building a sculling oar for his 30' (20,000 lbs I think) heavy displacement cruiser.  He claims Lin gets a sustained 2 1/2 or 3 knots (I forget which).

Lin isn't much bigger and was in her 60s when that was written.

Curtis

[curtisv]

I'm still waiting for a no wind day to try out the sculling oar.  This morning almost qualified, but the wind picked up.  I went out single handed.  Met up with the sea scout sailing a catboat and sailed with them a while.  Got to be "background" in someone's wedding photos I think.  Ended the day with six others on board (not from the wedding).  Perhaps a story for another thread.

Curtis

[GretchenG]

Okay, I'll keep the faith!