very strong lee helm

[gabi]

 hi guys

i'm new here, i just bought a cp 16 /1  and i did a bit of sailing in the past few weeks

the wind is relaly strong on lake lanier this time of year, and i sailed mostly with the main only, and reefed sometimes down to two thirds

i'm experiencing really strong lee helm ,to the point that the tiller is pushed all the way to the side,
i've read just about every post here,and the links, about lee / weather helm .

my mast is leaning back quite a bit, so that couldnt be a problem in the adjustment,

the weight on the back is just a trolling motor and battery, and me ...skiny guy

the sails are brand new

i really dont know what causes such a strong lee helm, i'm starting to freack out that i'm missing the front half of the keel or something...i bought the boat while on water, and i took it to my marina on the water... didnt see the bottom yet.

thank you

[Barnaclebill]

I have a unifoil rudder from Rudder Craft for my 16. Usually sail in 15+ kt winds with one main reef as well as with the fore sail to help keep the bow down. There's still a little weather helm, but not too much.

[Joseph]

Hi Gabi,

Is it "lee' or "weather" helm? Are you sure it is "lee" helm that you are experiencing?

In strong winds, with new sails, sailing under mainsail alone and with the mast raked aft it would not be at all surprising to experience a strong "weather helm", even if reefed.  On the other hand, under such conditions, experiencing any "lee helm" would be quite surprising, unless, as you rightly assume, something under the water is pushing the centre of lateral resistance aft...

J.

[Salty19]

Agree with Joe.

Lee helm is when the boat moved AWAY from the wind if you let go of the tiller. Weather helm is when it turns into the wind when you let go.  The tiller would point windward slightly in normal situations.

Without a jib and with the mast tilted back, it should have strong weather helm.

Maybe a bent rudder? 

I would first tilt the mast a bit forward like it's supposed to, maybe 3-5 degrees, check the rudder alignment and use the jib.  Then report back.

[gabi]

thank you guys,

i just got back from another sail, with the main only, this time full sail no reef.

the boat acted normaly, slight weather helm, like is supose to.( turning into the wind)...

the only thing i can think of is something in the way the sail is cut ,that when i reef it it gives me lee helm. Its begining to look more like a sail trim issue when reefed.

[Joseph]

I guess it is possible that when reefed (I am assuming slab reefing) as the sail is lowered and the slab at the foot gets removed from the sail foil, the leech would also "move" forward and so would the Centre of Effort (CE) of the sail. If this causes the CE to move forward beyond the Centre of Lateral Resistance (CLR) of the structures under the waterline, then lee-helm would be expected. 

J.

[capt_nemo]

MAKE SURE THE RUDDER IS IN FACT ALL THE WAY DOWN AS FAR AS IT WILL GO BEFORE LOCKING IT DOWN. Several Sun Cat Owners complain of strong weather helm as well. I think it is due to the rudder not being all the way down. If the rudder is NOT in its forwardmost position, and tilted even slightly aft, in stronger winds the weather helm can indeed be quite strong since the water is pushing against a longer surface area beneath the water which translates to increased pressure required at the tiller to counteract the force on the rudder. I make it a point to push my factory rudder down firmly 'til it can go no further and then lock it down. Have not experienced an excessive weather helm.

capt_nemo

[mandolinut]

Capt Nemo,
I am also new to this forum and did not realize you could lock the rudder down in the down position. PLease explain. Thanks.
Having sailed Hobies, I know what you are saying is true about the rudders not being all the way down causing severe weather helm.

[capt_nemo]

mandolinut,

On my Sun Cat kick-up rudder there is a tightening lever on the nut side of the pivot bolt that goes through the rudder head. When you have the rudder pushed ALL THE WAY DOWN AS FAR AS IT WILL GO the lever is used to tighten the head "locking" (holding) the rudder in the down position. Of course if you hit something really solid it will still kick up. If you don't have this on the 16 there might be a line attached to the blade that either pulls the rudder up or holds it down. If you don't have either of these items you may be able to add one to temporarily hold (lock) the rudder in the full down position.

capt_nemo

[skip1930]

So He's befuddled...and states, "i really don't know what causes such a strong lee helm ".

It appears that the limits have been exceeded and that one is sailing out of control.
Ain't it fun?

skip. No computer yet, have to use the library. Come on Santa!