Trailer brakes

[demanon]

Hi Folks
I am very close to making an offer on a 23/3!
My question has to do with their trailers. With one exception, none of the trailers I looked at had working brakes. My "expert" tells me that if one does not flush the drums every time the trailer is dunked then the brakes are probably no good. Does anyone even care about the brakes? Boat and trailer don't look to weigh much over 3,500# which in my opinion is not a lot of weight for any full sized SUV/Truck. I would appreciate any comments and really value this resource!
Thanks in advance.
Dave

[kchunk]

Howdy Dave. I bought my boat a couple months ago and traveled 400 miles to pick it up. The trailer has surge brakes but I don't think they were working. With the exception of the *CLUNK* when starting from a standing stop the boat towed and stopped just fine with our Honda Ridgeline.

BTW...which 23/3 are you looking at? I searched for mine for a few months and bought the '91 that was advertised on boartrader.com in Irmo, SC. The boat was in great shape but sat unused for 18 months. It was strange...the boat was fully outfitted like they went sailing on a Saturday and had every intention on sailing Sunday, but never returned to the boat. Lots of towels, sun screen, bug repellant...everything you'd need for a daysail. Unfortunately that also included 3/4 tank of gas. The supplies were appreciated but the gas was a gummy mess. After replacing the entire fuel system and rebuilding the carb, the boat has been treating us better than I could have hoped for.

Hope things go well with your purchase. Keep us posted!

--Greg

[Gil Weiss]

If you had to make a "panic" stop with 3,500+ lbs behind your vehicle you may begin to realize the value of operational surge brakes. In the 3,000+ trailer weight zone they can become very inportant. Sme states require them.

If not the law, it is a matter of what you feel comfortable with. Like some other safety devices, when you need them YOU NEED THEM. From what I know and my personal experience, a CP 23 trailer should have brakes.

My 2 cents, gil

[demanon]

Thanks Gil
You confirm the fact that it IS important to have brakes. I have plenty of experience with hauling large horses and it would be suicide not to have a proper braking system in place and I am looking at a boat now that has no trailer and one advantage of that boat is that I would have to spec out a new trailer (with probably disc brakes) which would be a big advantage over some other boat with a neglected braking system and trailer ..... all I know is that I WILL have CP 23 to sail this Spring and I am very excited! And I suspect it will be a 23D ... hopefully that is a good logic.
Dave

[Lost Lake]

Brakes are nice in a panic stop, and they save your truck brakes. I don't think 'any' truck is capable of hauling a trailer over 2000 pounds without brakes. Some trucks are pretty light.

That said, my CP19 trailer does not have brakes. I wish it did, but it doesn't. Legally I don't have to have them if the trailer is under 3000 pounds in Wisconsin, but I'd like them!

I have a Dodge 5500 so my brakes are pretty good. Still would like to have them on the trailer....

[kchunk]

I would expect most trucks to be able to tow a minimum 2000 lbs. Think about that midsize sedan pulling a car on a tow dolly, tooling on down the interstate. No trailer brakes there, and the average Honda Civic weighs at least 2250 lbs! Sure, I'd like trailer brakes on every trailer...heck, might as well go for ABS on trailers too, but expense has to be a consideration. IMO, laws regulating tow weights and brake requirements prevent less than 5% of tow related accidents. True prevention comes from using common sense. Take your time, leave plenty of distance, etc, etc. Sometimes no amount of braking will prevent that accident.

That 400 mile trip I made to pick up my boat took us 6 hours to get there and 8 hours for the return with the boat in tow.

--Greg

[Gil Weiss]

Greg - I would agree about 2,000lbs. I have pulled a cargo trailer with 2,000 or so weight with an F-150 with no problems. In a hard brake situation the weight did become evident as stopping distance increased dramatically. you could feel the additional strain on the truck brakes. On a business trip down to Charlotte I had to panic stop with this cargo trailer filled with a heavy trade show booth. (Some guy pulled right out in front of me on a highway) I near had to stand on the brake pedal but I did stop in time and the trailer stayed right behind the truck. It was scary.

Dave - I recently got a custom Load Rite trailer built for my CP19. The trailer has a capacitiy of 2,800 and weighs 685 for a gross weight of 3,475 assuming a 2,800 lb load. IT CAME WITH BRAKES! This trailer has torsion axels and disc brakes made for immersion in water. All sealed lights too. Load Rite would not make a trailer for over 3,000 lbs without brakes. I posted some pics of this trailer in the CP19 section of the gallery.

My CP19 weighs 2,000 but I allowed extra capacity for gear. I think the Magic Tilt trailers that they are sold with have less capacity and they do not have brakes. But, they seem to work OK as you don't read about problems. I just wanted a bit more capacity since I was having the trailer built from scratch. Also, the LR cost only about 250 more than the MT.

The problem is that no matter how safely you drive, etc. a panic stop can arise with no warning. . .

Gil

[Lost Lake]

Wow Gil, you have disk brakes on that beauty?  Sounds perfect!!

Krchunk; I think all those tow dollies have surge brakes don't they?

A huge consideration is the GVWR and GCWR of your vehicle. My truck weighs 8500 pounds but has a GVW of 19,000 pounds meaning I can carry 10,000 pounds. This also means it is designed to stop a full 19,000 pounds! Actually pulling my boat I don't even feel it back there.

My GCWR is 26,000 pounds, but that combined rating figures the towed trailer will have brakes. I pulled a trailer weighing 16,000 pounds a while ago that had good brakes and it sure was nice stopping. But sometimes I forget to hook up my RV brakes and I know it at the first stop sign, and the RV only weighs 12,000 pounds.

Pulling a load puts a strain on your tow vehicle, and if that vehicle is built for it it sure helps.

Don't label me as the 'Weight Police' now!  You should see what I have pulled with no brakes... On the farm my Grandpa would hook a 30,000 grain wagon on the back of our little WD45 and I would dread going down this one steep hill between our farms.... You know how those grain wagons wiggle and sway, and a little WD only weighs about 5,000 pounds so the wagon would start to push the tractor... and of course tractors have individual brakes I'd try to evenly modulate.... Yikes!! 

[Gil Weiss]

My tow vehicle is a 2006 Ford F-150 4WD with the factory towing package and the 5.4 liter V8. Plenty of towing capacity here, especially for the CP19. When I towed my CP16 behind my truck you hardly knew it was there, but the 19 is much heavier. In all my years of sail boating I never had a new trailer, so I splurged a bit this time.

But, the trailer is an important part of the equation so having one in good shape with the appropriate set up is important.

My previous truck was a 2001 F-150 2WD which was not as heavy duty as the new one. This is the one I needed to panic stop with the cargo trailer. It had a smaller engine too.

Bigger sometimes is better . . .  except for the gas milage! Actually, considering the 300 HP the new truck averages about 17.5 mpg which is better than my wife's 6 cylinder Jeep Grand Cherokee.

Regarding brakes, I used to drive big trucks when I was in the Army - I was in charge of the motor pool for a general hospital. I once had the hydraulic control unit go out on a 5 Ton truck and all 12 wheels locked up at 60 mph. The tires burned up and the brakes fused to the wheels by the time I skidded to a stop! That was fun! Everyone else in the convoy thought we caught fire.

Gil

[Lost Lake]

Ha Ha, I drove a 5 ton a couple times, but I usually had a duece and a half. Never saw one lock up, that must have been a sight!

I chipped my Cummins, I am getting 21 mpg on winter fuel with 425 hp and 850 torque. Sweet!  My old gasser used to give me 5.6 mpg pulling my RV. I don't miss that truck.