Tacking in heavy wind

[DW]

Greetings all.  I'm a relatively new (about 20 hours) Sun Cat sailor and could use any tips on tacking in moderately heavy wind.  Last weekend, my wife and I were tacking up our narrow home lake against 15-18 mph winds with frequent puffs over 20 mph.  It was slow going (the Sun Cat is rarely zippy upwind) but we made steady progress for most of the trip upwind.  Then I managed to get us in irons.  We started the tack with good boat speed, the bow came into the wind, the main came to midships, and then we stopped.  Really, sincerely stopped.  The bow refused to go over, the sail flapped, and soon we began to sail comically (to people on shore, I imagine) in reverse.  I was able to jibe around to resume progress, but this happened twice more before we were able to change course and reach happily homeward.  Other than needing more practice, any suggestions?  Also, has anyone else found the Sun Cat difficult to tack in stout wind?  We sometimes wallow in light air tacking, but I've never gotten into irons so often before.  Thanks for any input or commiseration.

[skip1930]

As Rich Hutchins commented to me at The All Sail Show, "Most people crab into the wind too much."
More tacs, less angle. Sail her loose. Let out the sheet till she flops on the back edge and pull her in till she smooths out.

I forgot and here is an EXCELLANT suggestion by capt_nemo. All boats need these.

Add tell tales so you can see the wind and how the sail works. If the tell tails are not flat against the sail, your doing something wrong.
I have tell tails on the leading edge, and the trailing edge.
Once in a great while I actually flatten all tell tails against both sails and then...OH BOY!

skip.

[gray]

I'll be interested in what the more experienced sailors advice but for what it is worth here are my experiences based on 4years of Suncat sailing on Lake Champlain. I've never had a problem tacking into a good breeze although when it drops below 5 knots it becomes more of a challenge. I have the original rudder (not the Ida one that supposedly would help) and find it to be very responsive. I am presuming that you had the centerboard fully down? Also I would definitely be reefed in that wind!  Cheers, Graham/svNemo2

[Salty19]

Not having sailed a suncat, I don't know for sure but am inclined to agree with skip.   Head off, gain more speed, then quickly and smartly move the tiller all the way over.

The foiled rudders do wonders on the sloops for tacking, I imagine they would be similar on catboats, or any boat for that matter.  On my old 16, it would not go into irons, but rather blow me away from the wind and forced me to jibe.  That really ticked me off a few times

[DW]

As Rich Hutchins commented to me at The All Sail Show, "Most people crab into the wind too much."
More tacs, less angle. Sail her loose. Let out the sheet till she flops on the back edge and pull her in till she smooths out.

skip.

Thanks.  Deep in my heart of hearts, I know I try to sail too close into the wind about 90% of the time.  Tack more, stall less.  I hope. 

[DW]

I'll be interested in what the more experienced sailors advice but for what it is worth here are my experiences based on 4years of Suncat sailing on Lake Champlain. I've never had a problem tacking into a good breeze although when it drops below 5 knots it becomes more of a challenge. I have the original rudder (not the Ida one that supposedly would help) and find it to be very responsive. I am presuming that you had the centerboard fully down? Also I would definitely be reefed in that wind!  Cheers, Graham/svNemo2

Thanks.  The board was all the way down and we were reefed.  Maybe (as Skip 1930 suggested) I was trying to sail too close to the wind.

[DW]

On my old 16, it would not go into irons, but rather blow me away from the wind and forced me to jibe.  That really ticked me off a few times

Thanks. What you just described sounds a lot like what we were experiencing last weekend.  The boat would be moving through the tack semi-well, but at some point the wind would simply seem to take over and force us backward and then around in a jibe.  This was especially bad when we reached a particularly narrow part of the lake between two points.

[ontarioSuncat]

I did notice that with the factory rudder the boat would tend to stall if I did not come about smartly. With the Ida rudder the boat moves through head to wind much better. In any case you have to have a bit of speed. Bear off a bit first to gather speed and then come about. That should do the trick.

[cavie]

Stop sailing it like a sloop. Never bull the boom in any farther then the end of the boom gallows. Not even that far in most cases. Sail it like a sloop with the genny only. If you want to tack, fall off for speed an tack sharply. No slow tiller movements. Tack past where you thing you should and come back up.

[capt_nemo]

And, if you want some help with those light air tacks, let the Jib/Drifter backwind ever so slightly before crossover and the bow will come right around. Yes, I do fly a homemade nylon Light Air Drifter on my Sun Cat. But, even if you fly a headsail, like others have said above, don't trim the main like on a sloop! (even if with a jib you technically are) Let that baby breathe.

It might help to add tell tales to your main like I did. I mounted 6 sets of red/green tell tales behind the leading edge of the mainsail. Four sets were spaced somewhat evenly a short distance behind the luff with the other two spaced behind the gaff at the head. These, coupled with the three sets of factory installed red leech tell tales (one at each batten) really help me visualize the airflow of the wind over the surface of the sail. And, once you corrolate the behavior of the tell tales to the behavior of the boat, you won't sail a Catboat like a Sloop for long!

[Joseph]

I have also added tell tales (x3, abt. two 1 ft from the mast and one aft of the gaff) and found them quite helpful for trimming the sail while close-hauled, close-reached and even beam-reached. The impression is that the angle within which both the inside and outside tell-tales lay flat may be narrower than in a sloop.

Still debating whether to switch to the IdaSailor rudder...

A question for Capt_nemo:

Would you have any pics and/or words of wisdom regarding your nylon Light Air Drifter on your SunCat?

J.

[capt_nemo]

Joseph,

Go down to the Post titled "attn: Hitchhiker Sun Cat Jib Sailing" - mine is the first reply which provides details and THREE Pics of the Marvelous Orange Wonder!

If you have any other specific questions feel free to send me a PM.

capt_nemo

[Tom Ray]

As Rich Hutchins commented to me at The All Sail Show, "Most people crab into the wind too much."
More tacs, less angle. Sail her loose. Let out the sheet till she flops on the back edge and pull her in till she smooths out.

skip.

Thanks.  Deep in my heart of hearts, I know I try to sail too close into the wind about 90% of the time.  Tack more, stall less.  I hope. 

These boats really punish you for pinching. Stop doing it, the boat will stop punishing you!