Compac 19 mast foot and bottom repairs

[patclem]

New member. Great to be here. Greatest day of owning a new Compac 19 was Sunday for me. Not sure what the second greatest day will be. lol

Anyhow, I have two key repairs to make before I put this baby in the water. First is the mast foot. The stainless bracket was all bent. Plus, the screws were pulled out. I've probed the holes and the wood is solid, maybe a little damp. My plan is to epoxy hardwood dowels in the holes just shy of the surface, cap with epoxy and redrill. I think the breakaway idea is a good one so no through bolts for me.

Second problem is someone has done some sanding on the bottom and I'm worried about getting the fiberglass soaked. What should I coat it with?

Pics are here:
https://www.flickr.com/gp/23855991@N05/71Qu1s

It also needs sails and an outboard. I'm probably going to let Mack make them. The outboard I'm seriously considering a Tohatsu propane Sailpro.

Oh and I have to fix the motor lift. I have some very old heavy duty Coriander I may use.

[wes]

I would not use wood dowels, because they will inevitably get water soaked and you're right back where you started. The gold standard is to remove all damp wood and fill the holes with thickened epoxy resin, then drill new holes through the solid epoxy for the screws.

Whoa, that's quite a repair on the mast. Wonder what trauma befell this boat to break or bend the mast in two places.

Wes

[patclem]

I don't know what happened to that mast.  If it's solid, I guess I'm good...  I'm not really into the idea of buying a new mast unless it's not much money, which I expect it's probably a lot.

The only thing I worry about with filling with epoxy is the wood screws holding.  The wood isn't necessarily rotten.  I think a PO had a mishap raising or lowering the mast - the metal bracket was bent real bad and I had to straighten it out on my big ole Chicago metal brake (I'm a serious hobbyist metal working / welding/fab/CNC plasma).  The threads of the wood screws pulled out.  I thought about using penetrating epoxy, but based on my probes with an awl there isn't much if hardly any rotten wood. 

I'm also trying to figure out a spec for the screws. They look to be 1" long, pan head, but need to get the threads right.  Big Box has sheet metal pan head screws. I guess I can get whatever I need from McMaster, or maybe Jamestown or Defender.

[wes]

Trust me. The epoxy will hold better than wood and will prevent water intrusion, which is a serious risk anywhere screws penetrate your deck. At any rate there is very little force on these screws (unless your mast falls off again!).

Order some West System epoxy resin type 105, hardener type 205, dispenser pumps, and colloidal silica thickener type 406 (1.7 oz size) from Defender. Very useful for a wide variety of boat repairs. If you are certain this is your last epoxy repair ever, West System also offers small repair kits.

Also, don't use wood screws. You want #10 self tapping screws, 1" long, pan head. Although I'd rather get a root canal than buy anything from West Marine, their stores offer an excellent selection of high quality stainless steel screws. Prices are ridiculous but you only need four of them.

Wes

[patclem]

So West Marine is about the only choice local. I have a gallon of 105 and 206. I read you can heat the repair area, pour in the epoxy, and when it cools it'll suck up the epoxy? I have thickener too and may glob that in after I let the thinned epoxy soak up. Not sure how to heat it other than my heat gun.

I picked up some stainless 1" 'sheet metal' screws - not the drilling ones. I assume they'll work alright. I also understand the low stress. Mostly keeps the bottom from kicking out more than up.

For the bottom, I also picked up some of their Topside paint, apparently made by Pettit. I used Majik paint once on my home built plasma table after everyone bad mouthed it, years later no scratches. Since the boat doesn't stay in the water I hope it'll do.

[Salty19]

Pat, ideally you drill out the holes all the way to the fiberglass on the bottom of the hole.  Worst case drill all the way through the cabin top where each of the 4 bolts reside

Drill it AT LEAST 2X the hole--3X is better.    If you are finding moist wood after drilling, let this dry out for a period of time first (heat it gently if you want, not a heat gun but a space heater would be OK).

Once you have dry wood, if you drilled all the way through cover the holes underneath with painter tape and swab some unthickened epoxy in the hole. Let it setup for a time but not to a cure. Reapply if the wood has absorbed it all.

Then pour in thickened epoxy and overfill it so there is a convex top.  It will settle and absorb into the wood some.

Let cure then sand it down flush and align your mast step.  Drill the holes you need slightly larger than the screw in the right spot. Apply melted wax to the screws then fill the hole again with thickened epoxy.  Before this cures, reinstall the mast foot and bolts.  Put saran down between the mast step and cabin top.  Secure the mast step and screws with tape--make sure all is aligned, straight and won't move.

Once cured, remove the bolts and remove saran wrap then reinstall the screws with sealant.

This will create threads in the cured thickened epoxy which will hold those bolts better than new.

Done and you won't have to touch this again.

[philb Junkie19]

i don't think you can go wrong following the procedure Salty described. There are a couple of things you might do if you encounter wet wood. Of course drying it is best.  I'm not sure about West System G Flex's holding power with screws but it could be worth checking out. West system G Flex is said to bond to wet wood but is more flexible than 105. I have found Gougeon Bros. has expert tech support with prompt replies by phone or email.  Of course you already have plenty of 105 on hand.  I have seen a nail bent to 90 degrees chucked in a drill illustrated and described as a way to scour out wet wood around the kind of hole Salty describes. I'd start with a small bend.

[patclem]

Well, I did most everything suggested except the nail thing.  At some point you have to stop thinking about it and start doing it.  I did end up drilling the hole out to 1/2", dabbing the hole with unthickened West 105, then followed with very thickened 105.  Dropped the step and the waxed screws (parafin - my vice-admiral had some for her feet) into place.  Before it was rock solid I backed the screws out. Sanded everything flush with 120 grit and used sealant to reinstall. 

Raised the mast for the first time this evening.  Love when it looks like a boat and not a big pile of wires and crap. I found half of a couple of the turnbuckles missing, a few clevis pins, etc.  Waiting on sails (Mack) and an outboard, and ordered a small fortune of spare parts to have on hand.  Also discovered I probably need new halyards.  They're pretty sun rotten and too short for whatever reason.

I also need to put some hull paint on where someone sanded the stupid thing and tried to spray paint it. I bought some West Marine paint, supposedly made by Pettit, so it's better than Home Depot paint I guess.

Pics here: https://www.flickr.com/photos/23855991@N05/albums/72157667587172317
That's my old Thistle in the background.  The vice-admiral (in the picture) wanted drink holders and I couldn't find anywhere to put them, so I bought this Compac.  LOL

PS - Funny how that West 105/206 kicks faster when it's a really hot day.  And thanks everyone for your advice.  It means a lot.  Hopefully the pictures will leave a trail for future repairers. 

[Andy Knoczek]

I am in the same boat... huh huh, doh! I went to replace my stock mast step with a new double pinned Dwyer SS mast step to discover ALL the wood under the step is soaked, the wood rotten into wet fiber slivers, like a slow cooked pork shoulder. My main concern with only doing epoxy saturation and fillers would make that flat surface area of deck compromised with mast down-compression. If I do the nail trick, or tediously scoop all the wet wood from the void, what should I replace with? I am thinking it will be a significant volume of space (5" x 8" x 3/4") - would filling the complete area with epoxy and filler be ok? That's a lot of material that would generate some heat. I am thinking cutting the FG top deck layer over the wood off and replacing the wood, then FG over top. My question is, anyone have a good strong material instead of the wood to suggest using? I build little plywood boats for fun and ALWAYS drill-epoxy-fill wherever HW penetrates, LOVE wood boats... HATE wood rot! Thanks! Andy

[philb Junkie19]

I bet you'll get the advice you need here:

Technical Services: Available 9:00am – 5:00pm ET
For answers to technical questions about the use of WEST SYSTEM Epoxy, contact our Technical Advisors:
Toll-free phone: 866-937-8797
Phone: 989-684-7286
Fax: 989-684-1287
E-mail: Complete a form to submit your questions to Technical Service by email. It may take one to two business days to answer your email. If you need immediate assistance, please call our toll-free number 866-937-8797.
https://www.westsystem.com/contact/need-help/

[wes]

Andy - I would avoid replacing the wood in this area. Since the area is penetrated by screws it's INEVITABLE that the water intrusion will reoccur in time if wood is present.

There are two reasons builders use wood in decks instead of solid epoxy/fiberglass: cost and weight. Neither is important here since the area is small.

I would saw off a rectangular section of the deck top layer slightly smaller than the mast step. This will allow the step to hide the repaired area and avoid the need for gelcoat repair. Then I'd clean out the rotten wood and fill with slightly thickened epoxy. It will take about a pint. I'd do it in several batches to reduce heat buildup, waiting until the previous batch kicks off but does not cure. For the cost of a quart of West 105+205 you'll have a permanent repair.

Wes

[Andy Knoczek]

Hi Wes, thank you! I was thinking that exact progression but wanted some experienced weight-in - and yours is much appreciated! Do you think a wood filler would suffice, or a silica combo perhaps?
Kindest regards,
Andy

[Andy Knoczek]

Here is what I installed, I didn't have time to "deal" with the base, I just shoved it up there after mod'ing the mast base and Dwyer support. But my next project is to drop the mast and fill the wood rot (now that I finally made a mast gin pole and crotch support!!)

[wes]

I would use colloidal silica for thickening in this application. Not too much because you want it to be runny enough to fill all the voids. Before pouring the first batch I would wet out all the interior surfaces with unthickened epoxy using a small brush. Silica gives you a lot of strength, to prevent the screws from pulling out, at the price of a difficult sanding job. I would probably stop filling when the repair area is still about 1/16" lower than the surrounding deck, then let it cure, clean off the blush, scuff it with 120 grit and finish the job with a fairing compound like Marinetex or Interlux Watertite. They are designed for easy sanding.

Wes

[Andy Knoczek]

Yes!! Thanks Wes... exactly what I was hoping to do. I may even lay some FG layers in the mix for good measure... and a matrix for the thinner epoxy layering, to aid in any inherent epoxy brittleness.