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#41
Picnic Cats / Re: Basic PC questions
Last post by passagesfromtheheart - May 27, 2025, 04:03:23 PMHi, Jon!
Thank you for chiming in on this thread and sharing your thoughts/experiences with your PC. That is so cool you've had your boat 25 years! Wow!!!
I suppose I'd be inclined to opt for adding the flotation bags if I were to get a PC, so I think I'll do a bit more digging into that to see how folks set these up. Bruce, I think you mentioned doing this as well, so I will look back to the info you shared on it. I guess it would give me some peace of mind that if events should happen such that the boat goes over - I wouldn't want to lose the boat.
I guess this topic has really been on my mind as, last night, I had a dream that my Hobie cat sailboat sank in her slip (I don't even have a Hobie cat!) and I later retrieved her - but, man, it was an odd dream! I could psychoanalyze that one all to you-know-what, but I won't go there here. :-D
Thanks, again, Jon, for sharing!
Thank you for chiming in on this thread and sharing your thoughts/experiences with your PC. That is so cool you've had your boat 25 years! Wow!!!
I suppose I'd be inclined to opt for adding the flotation bags if I were to get a PC, so I think I'll do a bit more digging into that to see how folks set these up. Bruce, I think you mentioned doing this as well, so I will look back to the info you shared on it. I guess it would give me some peace of mind that if events should happen such that the boat goes over - I wouldn't want to lose the boat.
I guess this topic has really been on my mind as, last night, I had a dream that my Hobie cat sailboat sank in her slip (I don't even have a Hobie cat!) and I later retrieved her - but, man, it was an odd dream! I could psychoanalyze that one all to you-know-what, but I won't go there here. :-D
Thanks, again, Jon, for sharing!
#42
Picnic Cats / Re: Basic PC questions
Last post by Jon898 - May 27, 2025, 08:03:15 AMI've had my PC for a quarter of a century now! Great boat for small lakes and sheltered waters. Not sure I'd be too comfortable in the ocean.
All of the sailing has been either single-handed or with one very inexperience crew (so essentially single-handed).
As with all small boats, trim is greatly affected by the location of the moveable ballast (you). When I changed from an old Yugoslavian outboard to using a MinnKota trolling motor, that change required adding a deep cycle battery which I secured just forward of the centerboard trunk below deck. The change from a motor hanging off the stern to a heavy battery just aft of the mast helped enormously with the trim, and she only drags her stern if I sit all the way aft.
There is no built-in flotation, and swamping/capsize has always been in the back if my mind, particularly since the cockpit locker hatches are not exactly well secured as-delivered. I have a link on my desktop to a supply of Opti flotation bags, but have never got around to doing that.
I wouldn't get too hung up on the gaff rig being different from a masthead rig. It actually provides the possibility of more controls (try scandalizing a masthead rig), and you get more difference with the cat rig as heaving-too is a new maneuver entirely.
Enjoy the search!
Jon
All of the sailing has been either single-handed or with one very inexperience crew (so essentially single-handed).
As with all small boats, trim is greatly affected by the location of the moveable ballast (you). When I changed from an old Yugoslavian outboard to using a MinnKota trolling motor, that change required adding a deep cycle battery which I secured just forward of the centerboard trunk below deck. The change from a motor hanging off the stern to a heavy battery just aft of the mast helped enormously with the trim, and she only drags her stern if I sit all the way aft.
There is no built-in flotation, and swamping/capsize has always been in the back if my mind, particularly since the cockpit locker hatches are not exactly well secured as-delivered. I have a link on my desktop to a supply of Opti flotation bags, but have never got around to doing that.
I wouldn't get too hung up on the gaff rig being different from a masthead rig. It actually provides the possibility of more controls (try scandalizing a masthead rig), and you get more difference with the cat rig as heaving-too is a new maneuver entirely.
Enjoy the search!
Jon
#43
Picnic Cats / Re: Basic PC questions
Last post by passagesfromtheheart - May 27, 2025, 01:20:41 AMBruce, oh my goodness — I'm so sorry to hear you're facing difficult situations as well. I hope everything will resolve in a manner such that you and your wife can get back out sailing soon. Sending support and positive thoughts your way — as well as fair winds.
Carl, I agree re: the price on that PC — love that dark green hull, too. Seller told me he has a brand new sail for the boat, too.
Carl, I agree re: the price on that PC — love that dark green hull, too. Seller told me he has a brand new sail for the boat, too.
#44
Legacy and Legacy Sport / Re: Water in cabin sole- bilge...
Last post by passagesfromtheheart - May 27, 2025, 01:12:44 AMHi, Zach ~
I am so sorry to learn about your Legacy's cabin sole having water. That would totally stress me out to have that happen. I can tell you, back in 2021, I corresponded with Gerry Hutchins of Com-Pac about how to access the bilge on a Legacy. He simply told me: "There is no bilge on the Legacy."
That said, if I was in the same situation with my Legacy, I'd be quite perplexed about what to do. If the water is only on the cabin sole, a full bilge would cross my mind as well as the culprit — but given what Gerry told me, it's a mystery how to access the area if one exists.
Do you know the YT channel 'Squally Heifer,' by chance? He also has a Legacy and may have some insight.
Please keep us posted on what you learn - this is certainly critical info for Legacy owners to have.
I am so sorry to learn about your Legacy's cabin sole having water. That would totally stress me out to have that happen. I can tell you, back in 2021, I corresponded with Gerry Hutchins of Com-Pac about how to access the bilge on a Legacy. He simply told me: "There is no bilge on the Legacy."
That said, if I was in the same situation with my Legacy, I'd be quite perplexed about what to do. If the water is only on the cabin sole, a full bilge would cross my mind as well as the culprit — but given what Gerry told me, it's a mystery how to access the area if one exists.
Do you know the YT channel 'Squally Heifer,' by chance? He also has a Legacy and may have some insight.
Please keep us posted on what you learn - this is certainly critical info for Legacy owners to have.
#45
Picnic Cats / Re: Basic PC questions
Last post by crazycarl - May 26, 2025, 11:36:41 PMIm not in the market for another boat, but that price is tempting.
#46
Picnic Cats / Re: Basic PC questions
Last post by bruce - May 26, 2025, 07:16:20 PMThanks for the kind words. If you want further input on the the PC and it's suitability for you please let me know, on list or off.
We too are facing new challenges. I've been a primary caregiver in the past, for my wife's parents and my own, and my aunt, all who lived with us at the end. I won't go into details, but I'm again the primary caregiver, this time it's even harder. I hope we'll be able to sail again, but that may not be possible.
Take care. We've got to play the hand we're dealt as best we can.
We too are facing new challenges. I've been a primary caregiver in the past, for my wife's parents and my own, and my aunt, all who lived with us at the end. I won't go into details, but I'm again the primary caregiver, this time it's even harder. I hope we'll be able to sail again, but that may not be possible.
Take care. We've got to play the hand we're dealt as best we can.
#47
Picnic Cats / Re: Basic PC questions
Last post by passagesfromtheheart - May 26, 2025, 02:34:11 PMBruce, you're the best -- thank you so very much for all of your words of wisdom -- for sharing your experiences with your PC and where you sail her! So much I've learned from you doing so! Cannot express enough gratitude!
This situation reminds me of another passion of mine that has evolved over my years of growing older. I used to competitively ride hunter/jumper show horses as a 'younger human.' Unfortunately, a diagnosis of BPPV (debilitating vertigo) forced (gave me the opportunity?) to switch from riding horses to driving/carting Miniature horses. Not having horses in my life was unacceptable to me as horses are in my blood (as is sailing) and so Miniature horses it was -- and still is, to this day.
Anyhow, it's like this with sailing. Giving up on sailing would be, in essence, giving up on myself...of who I am. But, I have to be strong enough and realistic enough with myself to understand that as I have aged and my body has changed, it means that to continue to enjoy my passions and 'be who I am,' I have to be willing, more than ever, to adapt. I feel that moving to a vessel like the PC (or maybe a Sun Cat) will allow me, afford me the opportunities to still keep sailing, but also sailing without the...um, burdens?...that sometimes 'bigger boats' might have. Not to mention, literally, affordability. Not having to lease a slip or a mooring; having to pay exorbitant amounts of money to maintain larger boats. Which is totally cool if that what's one heart desires. But, I've learned my heart is, more so, breaking as a result of these things. Especially spending money at marinas in which the environment is really not my cup of tea (that's another story).
I can see myself in my mind's eye -- to use your words -- ghosting along out on the water in my lil' PC. Feeling the breeze enough to make my spirits soar, but not raise the hairs on the back of my neck. :-) Sailing isn't always rainbows and unicorns, I realize, too, and we should always be in the ready of over preparation for the unexpected. But, boy, when those unicorn and rainbows moments gift me...I am in heaven, no doubt.
Thank you, again, Bruce, for all of the wonderful details you've shared -- so cannot thank you enough. And, Fred -- I think this PC is really close to you -- she's in Lake Geneva -- you're in northern Illinois, right? Here is the link, in case you'd like to check her out (I talked to the seller -- not the person who listed the boat on Facebook, but she will put you in touch with the seller - his name is Jack):
https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/2159811541123263/?ref=search&referral_code=null&referral_story_type=post&tracking=browse_serp%3A9d96767b-8b5e-4a8c-b06d-279219850301
This situation reminds me of another passion of mine that has evolved over my years of growing older. I used to competitively ride hunter/jumper show horses as a 'younger human.' Unfortunately, a diagnosis of BPPV (debilitating vertigo) forced (gave me the opportunity?) to switch from riding horses to driving/carting Miniature horses. Not having horses in my life was unacceptable to me as horses are in my blood (as is sailing) and so Miniature horses it was -- and still is, to this day.
Anyhow, it's like this with sailing. Giving up on sailing would be, in essence, giving up on myself...of who I am. But, I have to be strong enough and realistic enough with myself to understand that as I have aged and my body has changed, it means that to continue to enjoy my passions and 'be who I am,' I have to be willing, more than ever, to adapt. I feel that moving to a vessel like the PC (or maybe a Sun Cat) will allow me, afford me the opportunities to still keep sailing, but also sailing without the...um, burdens?...that sometimes 'bigger boats' might have. Not to mention, literally, affordability. Not having to lease a slip or a mooring; having to pay exorbitant amounts of money to maintain larger boats. Which is totally cool if that what's one heart desires. But, I've learned my heart is, more so, breaking as a result of these things. Especially spending money at marinas in which the environment is really not my cup of tea (that's another story).
I can see myself in my mind's eye -- to use your words -- ghosting along out on the water in my lil' PC. Feeling the breeze enough to make my spirits soar, but not raise the hairs on the back of my neck. :-) Sailing isn't always rainbows and unicorns, I realize, too, and we should always be in the ready of over preparation for the unexpected. But, boy, when those unicorn and rainbows moments gift me...I am in heaven, no doubt.
Thank you, again, Bruce, for all of the wonderful details you've shared -- so cannot thank you enough. And, Fred -- I think this PC is really close to you -- she's in Lake Geneva -- you're in northern Illinois, right? Here is the link, in case you'd like to check her out (I talked to the seller -- not the person who listed the boat on Facebook, but she will put you in touch with the seller - his name is Jack):
https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/2159811541123263/?ref=search&referral_code=null&referral_story_type=post&tracking=browse_serp%3A9d96767b-8b5e-4a8c-b06d-279219850301
#48
Picnic Cats / Re: Basic PC questions
Last post by Cpy23ecl - May 26, 2025, 12:10:56 PMBoats are just like with engines, there's no replacement for displacement when things get tough.
#49
Picnic Cats / Re: Basic PC questions
Last post by bruce - May 26, 2025, 11:54:53 AMAs much as we like our PC, and you are both experienced sailors, I think it's good to remind a less experienced reader that you need to match the boat to your sailing grounds. We sail well up in Narragansett Bay, isolated from ocean swells with maybe a knot of tidal current max except in very constricted passes. We do have an open fetch to the prevailing wind, and on summer afternoons can have sea breezes build to the lower 20s. If against the current, a significant chop can build. The coast is well defined, with some elevation, so the breeze does bend around the shore and structures. So, it's more like big lake sailing than ocean. In more sporty conditions we'll duck in the lee of the windward shore to get out of the fetch, unfortunately the ramp is usually a bouncy downwind run away.
Newport, on the ocean, is about 15 miles to the south, close enough to trailer to easily, but too exposed to ocean swells, winds, and currents for comfortable sailing in the PC, IMO. It could be done of course, but weather predictions aren't always accurate. I sometimes rent a J/22 with a more experienced sailing buddy for a day sail out of Newport. For a trip to Martha's Vineyard, an island 12 miles off the southern Mass coast, or 5 miles from Cape Cod, I'd really rather be on a Horizon Cat than a Sun Cat.
Newport, on the ocean, is about 15 miles to the south, close enough to trailer to easily, but too exposed to ocean swells, winds, and currents for comfortable sailing in the PC, IMO. It could be done of course, but weather predictions aren't always accurate. I sometimes rent a J/22 with a more experienced sailing buddy for a day sail out of Newport. For a trip to Martha's Vineyard, an island 12 miles off the southern Mass coast, or 5 miles from Cape Cod, I'd really rather be on a Horizon Cat than a Sun Cat.
#50
Sun Cats and Sunday Cats / Re: Is a Torqeedo 1003 L Adequ...
Last post by Jim in TC - May 26, 2025, 10:10:33 AMWe have been using the Torqueedo for some 6 years on a SunCat. With the larger capacity battery in light air there are probably reliably 5+ miles of modest speed. We have a spare in case of need but have never changed while under way. (depending on mamory from last year for all speed and distance estimates)
We can go modest distances at 5 or so MPH and much longer distance/time at 3 or 4. We have pointed into serious wind (25 gusting to 30) and waves (a bay, so little fetch but good 3 footers) for dousing or reefing sail and have hit its capacity to manage those maneuvers but have not yet exceeded its ability.
The controls have reliable info on remaining charge and distance available at the current speed.
We are happy with the motor and improvements in the last few years make it even more attractive. One thing they don't mention prominently is that they recommend a rebuild and new gaskets every 5 years, a fairly serious job that I left to the pros, but shipping the motor is no small thing. There are several authorized repair facilities in the US.
We use a remote control for speed/reverse and the tiller arm only for maneuvering in and out of our slip.
We can go modest distances at 5 or so MPH and much longer distance/time at 3 or 4. We have pointed into serious wind (25 gusting to 30) and waves (a bay, so little fetch but good 3 footers) for dousing or reefing sail and have hit its capacity to manage those maneuvers but have not yet exceeded its ability.
The controls have reliable info on remaining charge and distance available at the current speed.
We are happy with the motor and improvements in the last few years make it even more attractive. One thing they don't mention prominently is that they recommend a rebuild and new gaskets every 5 years, a fairly serious job that I left to the pros, but shipping the motor is no small thing. There are several authorized repair facilities in the US.
We use a remote control for speed/reverse and the tiller arm only for maneuvering in and out of our slip.