So as we deal with the winter storms here in the northeast (and other frigid regions of our beautiful nation) our thoughts often wander to thinking about the ideal sailing location. Don't get me wrong. I grew up in the Catskill Mountains and I totally love country living but as retirement looms closer it makes us think about warmer climate, LESS TAXES and a place where we don't have to cover our boat for 6-7 months in the year.
It seems that if you go too far south the summers are to hot to sail comfortably so is there a place in between, east of the Mississippi, that:
- one could sail 10 or 11 months in the year
- has reasonable taxes (compared to NY—that's easy)
- is not over crowed
Am I asking for too much?
What is your opinion, Folks?
-Allen
Kentucky
North Carolina
South Carolina
Lines of constant latitude with in those general east coast areas listed above. I don't care for salt water.
And the same 'lines' on the West coast. Which I have never looked in that direction because their too liberal.
Texas is out unless being fried alive appeals to you.
skip.
FL - NO State Income tax, low property tax. Northern Fl is MUCH cooler than Southern FL by 15 degrees, so you can live in one area and visit the other when the heat/cold gets uncomfortable for you. And as a trailer sailor it's easy to head to St Augustine, Key West, Pensacola, St Petersburg/Sarasota all with good sailing and more importantly great restaurants. I'm prejudice tho'
I live in NC, and it's hard to go further south, due to heat and humidity, or further north, due to cold in the winter.
I look around a lot, and if you are a coastal sailor, NC is better than SC or GA.
Lakewise, well, Kerr Lake is good up here. I like the river sailing of the Neuse the best.
Not going further inland or north, that's for sure.
PS, I moved here from MO, worst of both summer and winter.
The upper Gulf of Mexico. From Apalachicola FL, to Bay St Louis, MS. My favorite would be the Port St Joe/Mexico Beach area. Not crowded, you have a couple of months of relative heat and humidity, but that is also when the tourists are there unlike South, FL. the rest of the year you have it to yourself and the weather is great.
In Mississippi, if all of your income is pension, SS and a moderate amount of investment income, there is no State income tax and the property tax is about the lowest in the country. Sales tax is 7%. I'll end up in Ocean Springs, MS, only because I can't talk my wife into Mexico Beach.
St. Joe Bay, Wild Goose bay, Pensacola Sound and Bay, Mobile Bay, and the Mississippi Sound offer some of the best sailing grounds with lots of barrier islands and other destinations.
Yes every 30 years or so there is a Katrina or Camille, :o however, you don't have to go too far inland to isolate from them.
BTW, I currently live in North Mississippi and it is periodically very cold in the winter but not too much snow. Has to do with the Jetstream always dipping in a loop to pick us up. That said, I am looking at Wed./Thurs this week as potential sailing days. 8) The move south is primarily to get year round access to the Gulf of Mexico.
Very cool info, Brackish; I have looked at those areas as being interesting, but didn't know that much about them.
I'm about to give up on any collaboration with a move anywhere. Doesn't seem like my wife can get over the hurricane thing. Yeah, we have 'em; she brings up a hurricane as an objection no matter where it is. If there's EVER been one, it's too risky.
Well, as we get older, I'm thinking, what about a long-term lease instead? Wonder if that is a possibility.
great question, Allen, as we prepare for another weak system with the potential for 3 more inches moving in tomorrow night! we still plan on heading north.. contrary to just about everyone else's opinion.. I guess that the taxes in Maine are not all that favorable for retirees, but we will be low income retirees, so there won't be much for them to take!
North Carolina sounds appealing for lots of reasons.. sure are a lot of nice folks on this site from north carolina.. that would be something to consider :)
Don't give up on NY just yet.. we still have to stop by for a visit! jt
Having lived in NY both the Finger Lakes, The North Country, and the city; Texas (Houston & Austin), Louisiana (Baton Rouge & NO(favorite for food)), and now SW Virginia (Smith Mountain Lake) for the last 28 years, I would have to say VA is the best. While TX has no income tax, there is Pers. prop. tax, MUD tax, School tax, Sales Tax, and Real estate taxes That ARE Excessive. Louisiana - Has income taxes, gov't is corrupt, it's hot, humid, rains a lot, and FLLLAAAATTTT. And wet, did I mention it rains a lot?
Then there's Virginia - 300 +/- sunny days Sailing from March to December, some days in Jan and Feb (not this year except for New Years Day (unusual)). The income tax is low ~5% sales tax is low~5%, No gasoline tax Low pers prop tax only on boats, cars and trucks. No independent local school taxes, County real estate tax rate is ~$0.50/hundred. Mine are less than $1500/yr for waterfront property (y'all have seen pics of Timothy's Cove Lighthouse and Marina)
Need I say more? YES! Too many ex NJ & NY residents that like all of the above but want the intrusive Gov't zoning and other restrictive ordinances they had in NJ or NY. (I suppose that casts a poor light for you, Bob)
But I wouldn't trade this area for anything.
(http://www.visitsmithmountainlake.com/images/igallery/original/1-100/Linwood_Cook____Winter_300_1-11.jpg)
That's about all, Folks! TG
Hey Tim- speaking for myself (former NJ, current VA resident) AND for the infamous Bob23, neither of us appreciate onerous government intrusion and regulation of our affairs! We had even considered arming our Compacs on Barnegat Bay and marauding the Governor's Mansion on those hallowed shores! The Admiral and I are loving the Deltaville area for all the fine reasons you mentioned........don't go painting us Jersey expats with that broad liberal brush! I've been trying to get Bob23 to visit down here, but he is afraid that he might not go back to NJ!! ;)
This is very interesting. Tim, I just bought the place next to you! Hahaha!!!! ;D
Believe it or not, I really like NJ. In 3 1/2 hours one can drive from coastal plain to glacial mountains. Ok, small mountains. It has great seasonal changes and unlike Skip, I like salt water. The problem here is that it's so expensive to live here.
Most of you guys probably haven't seen the best parts of my state. The Pinelands are expansive and wonderful. The sailing is great...we don't have to deal with light or no winds in the summer.
Having said that, I'm looking into Delaware as a possible retirement move. I still have lots of family here that I don't want to be too far away from. (Some I'd like to be REALLY far away from!)
I'm gonna closely follow this thread.
Bob23
(ps: Just read P23's post while I was typing. NJ is a very interesting state in that the Northern and Southern parts are almost as different as the North and South of the country. I'm in the southern half
and one thing we like to mention to the northerners who visit: "Don't tell us how you do it up north!")
(pps: I might not come back!!!)
Don't rule out SW Fl. We live in Punta Gorda and sail year round. Frankly we have not found the summers to be any worse than DE where we lived for many years. The temp rarely gets above 92-93 and being near the water, there is usually a light breeze. We have been here for three years having moved from the Finger Lakes. Taxes are very low and the area is retiree friendly. The keys are a few hrs and an easy drive away as is NW Fl. We love it here and have never looked back! ;D
We went through a similar exercise a few years back as I was planning to retire from my 10-year sentence in Indiana (previously NJ, IL, PA, TX, Europe). The solution (for us) came out to be a very "right-brain" one as the final location doesn't have the gee-whiz retirement dream of overlooking the water and seeing the boat on our own mooring. In addition to the usual Goldilocks temperature criterion (not too cold for too long and not too hot for too long), we had a couple of others:
- reasonable airport access
- not part of a major metropolis
- genuinely friendly people
- decent boating access (lake and ocean)
- some cultural access
- far enough inland to avoid the brunt of hurricanes
- a community/development that wasn't centered on golf
- fewer thunderstorms (our home in IN burned down after a 2:16am lightning strike)
After a lot of looking we ended up just south of Chapel Hill, NC. We're a bit over 2-1/2 hours from the Neuse and 12 minutes from the sailboat ramp at Jordan Lake, so garage to sailing on the lake is about 40 minutes singlehanded and less with crew. I was sailing in November, and there were sailboats racing on Jordan in January.
Taxes did not sway things significantly either way once we had eliminated FL (personal decision...summer temps, storms, insurance costs, distorted real estate market). I figure governments get their money somehow, and unless there's another source (tourists in FL, gaming in NV, oil in TX and Alaska) they'll get you anyway.
We're happy with the decision we made, but this is all very personal. Many absolutely love FL and others don't (in NC they're sometimes referred to as "half-backs" since they moved to FL from the northeast and then moved "half way back" and ended up in NC). It's going to be whatever floats your boat (sorry, had to say it ::) ).
Allen, I'd recommend listening to all opinions, come up with a shortlist and then spend some time in those locations at as many times of the year as you can. Above all though, have fun!
Jon
Virginia is great. Four seasons. Sailing from March to December on Smith Mt. Lake. Short trip to sail on the Chesapeake Bay. We live in the mountains (Lynchburg) and can easily visit Richmond, Williamsburg, Norfolk and Washington, DC.
PS Moved here from Plattsburgh, NY, Sister lives in Buffalo. and I went thru grade school there.
Wow! There is a lot of great input on this subject, folks. I am feverishly taking notes.
Thanks for all your opinions.
Atrometer... I have a cousin that has lived near Ft. Myers for over 20 years. She is moving back to upstate NY but for family reasons.
-Allen
Tmorgan,
Where are you? I live in Lynchburg too! We need to support Tim with his next SML festival. Give me a call 237-5142. Maybe we can get a fleet of ComPacs sailing nearby, sometime soon.
I like central VA living, just wish the coast was a little nearer.
Dave
Florida is your best option for the reasons already listed. I've lived in other states too, but this is the only place I've lived where I can comfortably sail year round in swim shorts and t-shirt. Sure, it's hot in the mid-day sun in the summertime. I avoid mid-day and I seek shade, such as a bimini. In the shade on the water, it's great!
Quote from: Eagleye on February 16, 2014, 06:06:17 PM
Wow! There is a lot of great input on this subject, folks. I am feverishly taking notes.
Thanks for all your opinions.
Atrometer... I have a cousin that has lived near Ft. Myers for over 20 years. She is moving back to upstate NY but for family reasons.
-Allen
We got our family members from up there to move down here. Would only go back for a visit and to sail on Lake Champlain!!
Yeah I think Jon898 is on to something. You have to expand the criteria somewhat to include the other things you plan to do with your life. Most folks will not be sailing all the time. Thing is, I've lived in Key West, Charleston, Jacksonville NC, Annapolis, Bainbridge and Severna Park, MD, Philadelphia, Newport RI, Tulsa OK, Biloxi, Gulfport, Hattiesburg, and Tupelo, MS and have had extended stays in other places including Spain. I've never been anywhere that I didn't like for some reasons and never left a place and said, boy I'll never come back here. Guess it comes down to seeing what is offered and adaptability.
My sister lived in NJ in farm country for a number of years, and she loved it. It is a completely different image than what the uninformed perception of the state might be.
For me the sailing has to have destinations within a few hours. It has to have some destinations that are pristine and isolated and also some where I can sail up, dock, and have a meal or drinks at a nice dock side establishment. It has to be an area where both the fresh and salt water fishing is great. When I'm not sailing, it cannot be an area that has crowds and traffic. It has to have a laid back atmosphere. It has to be an area where I can engage in my woodworking addiction and be able to get the things I need for that. It has to be an area that my sons and their families will want to come to and be reasonably accessible from the air for that purpose. It helps if other friends and family are there. It has to be an area that is in need of the kind of volunteer work my wife is passionate about.
Add back the original post criteria and for me, the upper Gulf of Mexico still wins by a landslide.
Snowing again today. :P
6 -10" predicted.
20+mph winds.
I spent the morning searching realestate sites in Florida.
There aren't many affordable homes close to the water.
I did find some lots I liked, just don't know if I want to go through having a house built again.
CC
I'm in a situation where I'm the only one who would go; I am a bit farther from the coast than I like, but it's do-able.
I sure like the idea of the Punta Gorda area; maybe a little bit inland. I think an hour's drive to a boat that is right near the sailing area would be ideal.
Heck, I would actually go to the tropics if I could.
However, NC is definitely a good place to be; Richmond, VA would also be a good locale.
Quote from: Sterling on February 16, 2014, 07:07:00 PM
Florida is your best option for the reasons already listed. I've lived in other states too, but this is the only place I've lived where I can comfortably sail year round in swim shorts and t-shirt. Sure, it's hot in the mid-day sun in the summertime. I avoid mid-day and I seek shade, such as a bimini. In the shade on the water, it's great!
Thanks for that Sterling. Coming from the NE, dealing with the FL summer heat seems daunting but sailing when it is a little cool is ok. My final sail last season was in November and the temps started out at 38 and rose up to a high of 42 for the day. That is what I would like to avoid.
(http://i1058.photobucket.com/albums/t403/eagleye54/1455153_10202341246480848_969456558_n_zpsfd8cf575.jpg) (http://s1058.photobucket.com/user/eagleye54/media/1455153_10202341246480848_969456558_n_zpsfd8cf575.jpg.html)
:-\
-Allen
Quote from: crazycarl on February 17, 2014, 02:08:57 PM
Snowing again today. :P
6 -10" predicted.
20+mph winds.
CC
I’m sorry to hear that Carl, especially since the same storm is heading our way next!! ::)
-Allen
Yes, Carl you DO want a house built in Florida and you want me to build it! See how easy it is?
When do I start?
Bob23
Might I add that Appalachian Power Company heats Smith Mountain Lake?
Water is drawn from the lake for hydroelectric power in the peak daytime hours. Off hours when there is less demand, water is pumped back into the lake from the thin water downstream; the Staunton River/Leesville Lake impoundment. Water from that reservoir is solar heated during the day, thus it heats some of the lower SML the next night. Spring sailing comes a little earlier near the dam.
Sorry to slip off topic, just waiting for Spring . . .
I see no one has given much thought to sailing west of the Mississippi. I've only lived in Texas and Colorado (the latter for so long my Texas friends don't recognize my English "no more"). And as a retiree, I'm sticking to CO even though the sailing season is generally only from late spring through early fall. I have sailed here, though, in every month except February...but, wait: yesterday was 73...hummm.
I have kept a sailboat, at one time or another, in the Galveston Bay area, Corpus Christi, Newport Beach and Redwood City, in addition to several trailer sailboats I keep in CO (currently one is a CP 16/III...you can find a story and pictures of that one in the Jan/Feb issue of Small Craft Advisor).
Summer sailing on high mountain lakes in CO is simply superb, though mountain weather can be testy at times. It's certainly scenic, not hot and generally dry except for summer showers. I sailed out of Key Largo one week in July and really loved the area, except for the heat and humidity. I'm certain it's wonderful other times of the year. When I kept a boat in the TX gulf coast area, I generally flew down to sail only in the fall, winter and spring, and avoided the worst of the heat and humidity. I loved sailing in the fall out of Annapolis several times, too, but not sure I'd like it there in the summer.
Anyway, back to the West...Redwood City, CA is a wonderful year-round sailing area. Much drier and more pleasant weather than San Francisco just up the road to the north (though sailing there near the Golden Gate was certainly memorable). Of all the places I've kept a boat, I found the weather in Redwood City to be great, which the city promotes with a big sign advertising the best weather in the country....
But, Skip, I'm a liberal, so I find CA welcoming and very friendly. Moreover, I like salt water just about as much as fresh water, so long as I'm not too far from shore. As to taxes and such, I've decided long ago to not worry too much about that stuff. Colorado is not cheap place to retire, but I figure I can still pull a sailboat to just about anywhere else whenever I want, especially with a small enough boat I can easily rig and camp in some along the way. That's exactly why I like my CP 16. And when summer comes, man oh man, those mountain lakes....
Jett
Quote from: Citroen/Dave on February 17, 2014, 04:45:17 PM
Might I add that Appalachian Power Company heats Smith Mountain Lake?
Water is drawn off from the lake for hydroelectric power in the peak daytime hours. Off hours when there is less demand, water is pumped back into the lake from the Staunton River/Leesville Lake impoundment down stream. Water from that reservoir is solar heated during the day, thus it heats some of the lower SML the next night. Spring sailing comes a little earlier near the dam.
Sorry to slip off topic, just waiting for Spring . . .
Not off topic at all, Dave. SML has caught our interest for a while now so any info is appreciated and interesting.
Thanks,
-Allen
Interesting thread. Don't forget to include the mosquito/black fly/green head/no see 'em quotient as a point of comparison. Some things are worse than heat and humidity.
Tom
Cattail
Lake Harris, FL
Sailing...... what is that? I think when spring comes in I might have to relearn...... and I work on boats at a marina all winter.
I think someday when my wife and I retire, we should go to somewhere where you can see atleast 10 feet into the water, that would be nice. I have several years to figure out where to go though... I am just 32 :(
I think I am going to go out and get out my 155, and wrap up in it in the house while playing sounds of the ocean...................
Mac :P :P :-\
Oh Yeah!! Did I not mention the ABSENCE of mosquitoes at SML? :-X
TG