Sometimes or in my case most times I make a small problem a bigger problem. This time in an attempt to find/eliminate a small nuisance leak I thought I'd rebed my port genoa track. It should not be a big issue, just remove all those 1/4 machine screws, rebed the track and replace. When I removed the 1st one I thought "maybe this isn't such a good idea. What if the nuts turn on the inside?" Looking in the cockpit locker, the only thing I saw was the glassed over hull/deck joint and assumed that the nuts were captive in the fiberglass & as long as the screws backed out ok, I should be able to replace them. So I got my power screwdriver out and removed them. Only one nut turned but a little pressure on the track and it backed out fine. I cleaned everything, chamfered the screw holes in the gel coat a little bit, got out a new tube of 4200 and started replacing the screws. At first everything went fine but then one nut became "uncaptive" and then another and another and .... The track is now held in place with about half the original fasteners with the majority missing in the area where the genoa block normally would sit when sailing.
So here is the million dollar question. How do I fix this? Can I fill the holes with marine tex, run a 1/4-20 tap into it & replace the screws? Would filling the holes and using would screws in place of the machine thread screws be strong enough? It would really stink to be close hauled and find out they aren't. Do I need to do something more drastic? Any & all suggestions would be appreciated.
One more thing, I still have the leak! :'(
Bille
Well if there is a will there is a way...
No filling, tapping or screwing down such an important part of the boat. Nut and bolt.
Your going to have to snap a small needle nose vice grip onto the 1/4-20 nut. One at a time.
Somebody topside will have to turn the screw. By hand, not with an electric screw driver IMHO.
Start in the middle of the track and work to each end.
That way the hull's shear will be taken into account. Use your favorite 'goop' or sticky tape. [I'd used 3-M 5200 Slow Set, no one on CPYOA likes this 'goop'.]
If you can't snap a vice clamp on, then to reach the threads on the bolts to start the nut, you'll have to pull, bend, wedge or drill from the deck down through the innards. [Why chamfered the screw holes? Yea you could fill a hole with Marine -Tex.]
Now the really hard part. To start the washer and the nut on the threads when you can't twist your wrist or flex your hand to hold a washer and nut.
The way I did this to add four stanchions and life lines on my boat, plus a stern pulpit [I have an XL, so a hard fiberglass one piece roof that I had to get up under.] was to have the wife top sides to push down and turn the 1/4-20 bolt with an 1/8" ratshit and socket while the washer and nut were super glued to the tip of the index finger. I could barely touch the tip of the bolt. Once started I could hold the nut with a specially bent wrench. Its a pain but we "Gotter Done" son.
skip.
I have to ask, can you not get to the backside?
I used Butyl to bed mine down, kinda cool, not sure if it leaks yet, but later this week she will get the water test with the hose...... I hope she holds up!
OH, and I ended up buying about 150 bucks worth of new hard ware all over the boat due to the builders choice to cut off all the bolts..... some hardware was even bent.
All worth it though, cause if it does develop a leak it wont be a problem to fix.
Mac
Nuts captive in the fiberglass for a genoa track?? ??? I've never heard of that. I doubt that ComPac would do that. That has zero chance of long term survival. Normally they are through with a backing plate or at least large reinforcing washers.
I would call Hutchins and get a section drawing that gives the details of the track installation. I'm sure you must be able to get to the nut side somehow, even if it is under a trim piece or a piece of headliner fabric.
For the ones that are loose, why not just get longer screws, new nuts and new bolts?
-Speak
Bill - I'm in the same boat, so to speak. In process of stripping off all the deck hardware from my 27 so I can sand and paint, and the genoa track hardware has me flummoxed. Cannot figure out how to get to those nuts. If they are accessible, they're VERY well hidden. If you figure this out before I do, please post!
Wes
Guys,
The nuts are not "captured" and they can be gotten to..... Just not easily. They can look like they are because I think the track is put in place before the top/bottom halves of the boat are joined, at least on Miss B. I have had her tracks off both sides twice. If you look up and outward from inside the aft lockers you will be able to see them. As they run forward they will sort of disappear into the head area. My interior in this area has changed from original and actually is apart again so I will snap a couple shots of the area if interested but some amount of interior will have to be removed.
Bille,
Don't know if this will be any help but snapped this.
(http://i886.photobucket.com/albums/ac70/jimyoung29/2_zps023a6d8f.jpg)
And behind this is this. I replaced the nuts with lock nuts and re-did the covers to be removable.... somewhat. I learned so much in doing it I am doing it all over again now :)
(http://i886.photobucket.com/albums/ac70/jimyoung29/1_zpsc7b97b48.jpg)
You can see where the two halves of the boat were seamed and some of the glass gets on or near the track hardware.
Hope that helps and good luck!
Jim, thanks. I'll will have to take a closer look this weekend. I must admit that it was getting late, & I was getting tired (and thirsty). :-[
Bille - after crawling around in the bilge this weekend, I can confirm that the nuts are glassed over, at least the aft-most ones visible from the bilge. Looks like Hutchins bolted the tracks to the deck before assembling the hull/deck joint, then covered the nuts when they glassed over the inside of the joint. The nuts are not deeply embedded in solid epoxy - just covered with a single layer of fiberglass cloth like a flap.I will probably use a roto-zip or something similar to trim away an area about 1" in diameter at each nut location, and then the nuts will be easily removed.
Wes