Just bought a new 23/IV and want some advice on treating the topside teak wood. I've heard conflicting opinions on each of the treatment method: Cetol, teak oil and vanish.
anybody got some popcorn? this should be good!
Seriously, this has been discussed at length here on this form. And there are many different opinions.
I like all of them except cetol.
Do a search in the top right and you will find lots of info. Including pictures.
This is a never-ending topic because everyone is different and has different expectations. I like my boat looking good, but above all I am lazy, and i prefer sailing to sanding and varnishing. As a result, I use teak sealer (a heavier version of teak oil), through on the stuff twice a year, and live with the fact that rather few people stop by the boat to admire the woodwork. It looks good, but not exceptional, but it is easy and quick to do.
Billy - you're right about the popcorn, but I think something stronger might be needed if we have to re-hash this debate yet again. I vote for Margaritas and guacamole.
I currently have a running experiment going on my 19. I did an extensive disassembly and refinishing job on all my trim - removed every bit of it, sanded, replaced some pieces which were too far gone from years of neglect. I refinished the tiller and bowsprit insert with Minwax "Helmsman" exterior polyurethane varnish, which is commonly available at Home Depot, Lowes etc. I did the drop boards, hatch sliders, and eyebrows with Cetol which I had to order from Defender or West Marine. The Helmsman product is much less expensive, and I expected it would not perform as well as the Cetol which is billed as a specialized marine finish.
After 18 months outdoors (North Carolina), somewhat to my surprise I like the Helmsman better. It has aged very gracefully - lost some of the surface shine and acquired a matte finish, but no flaking or peeling, no water intrusion underneath, etc. The color is more to my liking - a little darker and browner, compared to the Cetol which leans to an orange tint. The Cetol is softer - it feels like it could easily be scratched or scraped. The Helmsman is much harder.
Now I have to make up my mind, since I have a 27 taken apart and ready for painting, and all the teak is piled up in my basement. Decisions, decisions. I am leaning to the Helmsman.
Wes
i used helmsman on all of the trim in the house that i am building.. just could not resist that name! i am glad to hear that Wes is having good results with it, and I hope that it holds up a even better indoors than it does outside :) i am not planning on touching it for a long time! jt
I've just about finished refinishing the teak on Meridian. I'm using Cetol. I used Cetol for many years on the Catalina 22 that I had before this boat. I like the soft look, and I like how easy it is to touch it up. On Meridian I did the hatch boards and tiller in Helmsman poly 2 years ago. It has held up well on the tiller, but I'm a bit disappointed in its performance on the hatch boards. On those I started with 2 coats of e-poxy to seal it and then 6 coats of Helmsman. You'd think that would be an indestructible finish! But on the upper and lower edges it has worn to the point of needing to be re-coated.
-Speak
My Com-Pac 23/IV was delivered in August 2011. I opted for Cetol. Big mistake! This year I scraped all the Cetol off and switched to teak oil.
The best choice may depend on where you live. Here in the Pacific Northwest we get a lot of rain. The Cetol instructions say that it must be applied when it is > 50 F, dry and overcast. We don't have many days that meet all three of those criteria. I ended up with lots of black mold forming under the Cetol layer.
Cetol is tough to apply, especially on small thin pieces (eyebrows) like those above our portlights. If you get any on the fiberglass, you must wipe it up right away or it's hard to remove. And, once on the wood, it takes forever to dry! Teak oil is a lot less work. Even if you have to apply it often, it takes only a few minutes to do all of the wood. You can do it in any temperature and there's no problem if you slop some on the gelcoat.
Welcome Dadamia:
Yes, you are right. It does depend on your home climate. I've not had the mold issue with Cetol that you have but it also dries out down here in NJ from time to time.
Looking forward to your future posts!
Bob23 in NJ and 1985 23/2 "Koinonia"
Wow, here we go again. I was at the boat yesterday doing the de-winterizing/major cleanup, contemplating what to do about the teak on my 23/IV. ??? The original owners used Waterlox Marine, and I was unimpressed with that longevity. I switched to Bristol, and while I love the look when freshly done, I can't say I'm impressed with the longevity. I did however miss the fall maintenance coat while in Spain, but it just has not held up to my liking. I've never used Cetol, but don't really like the look. On my last boat I used teak oil exclusively, and I liked the look but it had to be done every three months or so to maintain (clean/brighten/oil).
I think location and logistics does matter. On the oiled boat, weather and proximity allowed that quarterly attention, and that was a relatively easy process. On this boat neither weather nor proximity allow that.
I'll probably go back with Bristol, one more time because I have it and would have a difficult strip to move to something else. But after we move to the coast, I might bite that bullet, strip it and go back to oil.
I think this one may take more than popcorn and margaritas. I think this may take moving right to the hundred proof bourbon. ;D
I've already stated my position on teak finishing so I'll not repeat it here. Most of you guys know what I use. But, really are any of us brave enough to just leave it alone? It turns a wonderful silvery grey and probably will last the life of the boat if it's cleaned up now and then. I'm too much of a coward and too committed to Flagship varnish.
I'm not much of a whiskey drinker but my plumber is trying to turm me onto Knob Creek 9 year old. Any feedback? I probably will stick to my occasional Gosslings Rum.
Bob23
I let mine turn a bit silver. And then I use a cleaner & brightner & then some oil. Maybe do that once a year. & I live in FL where the UV is pretty tough.
I did sand it once about 3 years ago.
freshly sanded-no treatment (my favorite...)
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af237/billybbingham/DSCN9601.jpg) (http://s1011.photobucket.com/user/billybbingham/media/DSCN9601.jpg.html)
sanded and lots of teak oil
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af237/billybbingham/P3200131.jpg) (http://s1011.photobucket.com/user/billybbingham/media/P3200131.jpg.html)
how it looks today.....(well....last weekend anyway)
(http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af237/billybbingham/MeganandBilly2013004_zps27683883.jpg) (http://s1011.photobucket.com/user/billybbingham/media/MeganandBilly2013004_zps27683883.jpg.html)
At the St. Pete boat show I found out that a good way to apply the oil is with a spray bottle. I have yet to try.
Also, my major complaint about cetol is that I have not seen a boat that has cetol on its wood that does not have cetol on its fiberglass. MESSY stuff that does not come off very easily. And I don't like the greesy look.
However, the pic Brackish posted of his drop board w/ the Bristol looked wonderful! Sorry to hear that it has not held up.
I was glad to see this post, but at the same time knew of its existance all over the forums. Even after reading all the stuff on the forums, each time, I change my mind.....
I research stuff like crazy before setting my mind to a certain way. Makes me a excellent repair guy (if I dont say so myself) but I get carried away with trying to attain perfection. This is my issue on the teak......
Big affect is what climate. Each climate dictates a really good way of coating it.
Last year I used CETOL..... It is what the majority use on Carlyle Lake. I personally dont much care for it, but that could be because it is on the old teak which is rough as hell, and I am not a fan of rough feeling wood.
I bought some teak (at a premium for crying out loud.....) and am trying to set my mind to what I am going to do when I finish cutting the parts.
Now thanks to this post, I am looking into Helmsman..... only because I read it here..... LOL
Yet another option to add to the list. My Interlux Rep is trying to get me to use his spar varnish and a month long process of coating them.....
You would think a guy who has been working on boats for 16 years, a freak about being informed, perfectionist by nature, who really has a great appreciation for looks and finished product would know somthing about teak refinishing.... but I am clueless.... and we dont work on teak at the shop.
looking forward to watching this post.
Mac
I used to use Cetol and switched to using is Semco sealer. It's water based so applying it doesn't require taping and maintenance involves washing the teak and applying a coat or two. It is not glossy and looks like freshly cut teak.
http://www.semcoteakproducts.com/SEMCO_PRODUCTS.HTM (http://www.semcoteakproducts.com/SEMCO_PRODUCTS.HTM)
(http://www.rahnlawton.com/webpics/2009%20Horizon%20Cat-02.jpg)
Rhan,
.....nuff said!
You got me convinced!
Rhan,
which shade are you using? and have you used others?
I use the natural and I haven't tried any of the other shades, though I know some people like the gold tone. The previous owner destroyed the teak using a pressure washer and literally slapped on a coat of Cetol which, of course, is all over the fiberglass. Initially, I sanded all the teak and used Semco's two part cleaner and now put on a coat or two in the spring using a foam brush. Any that drips onto the the fiberglass is cleaned up with a rag.
(http://www.rahnlawton.com/webpics/2009%20Horizon%20Cat-04.jpg)
I had to scrape off a traditional varnish off all my teak on my 3rd boat, an unbelievably demanding job of special reaching scrapers/tools, time, and manual dexterity. I have seen neglected Sikkens Cetol , that NEVER required such
removal . Also when applied as directed, a minimum about 3 coats on rails, and about 6 on high traffic, foot trodden surfaces. Also they recommend a paired product for applying as a hard or high glossed surface. Look up the reviews and
long term test results in Practical Sailor, you will see how Cetol performs when applied correctly.
Once you clean and remove all mildew, mold, old varnish - it will be like glue, and also fills badly sun etched groves in old teak.
Just my 2 cents.