Com-Pac Yacht Owners Association

I'm  thinking about buying a 1983 16 on a Magic Tilt trailer. I looked at the boat yesterday and for the price (<$1500) both the boat and the trailer are in great shape. There are a few small projects to be done, like replacing some missing small hardware, but I think it's a steal and I really want the boat.

My problem is that when I backed my Subaru Crosstrek up to the trailer to eyeball it, I can't see how I would ever be able to get the boat off the trailer on a normal boat ramp without seriously submerging the back of the car. I know other people are trailering these boats with smaller cars, so how big of a problem is it? I've been reading about the hitch/tongue extensions, and I think that eventually I could cobble something together, but my main question is this:

Is it just a pain, or is it nearly impossible to launch and recover a 16 off the Magic Tilt trailer with a small car on an average boat ramp?

I haven't found a good solution to the extension problem that wasn't too expensive, too bulky, or over my level of fabrication ability. The closest thing I've found is to stack a couple of 18" hitch extensions at the boat ramp to get the hitch further back. Any other good/cheap off the shelf solitions?

Mr. J,

That is a great price for the cp-16.  I also drive a Subaru and looked closely at several cp-16 last year.
I was a bit concerned that a fully loaded CP-16,  would be right at tow capacity.  I was not too concerned about towing, but I looked closely at ability to stop with such a light car (Outback).  As I wanted to travel long distance on highway, and envisioned relatively short sails when I got there, I went with a Picnic Cat.  These are very hard to find used, and much, much more expensive for arguably less boat. Ease and speed of launch were my key objectives.

With the board up, and Subaru rear tire at water line (little wet) I have no issues launching.
If I had a stub keel, I would be thinking 2 18" hitch extenders.  I saw best price for these at Harbor Freight.

If you will constantly be using the same ramp, you may be able to rig chain to give you those extra feet to get her to float.  I am not an expert, and this should probably not be considered a "safe" practice, but I have seen it used with a Cape Dory Typhoon.  They use the trailer jack wheel (a big double wheel type), to make trailer a tri-wheel cart.

the car really has no play in how far you go back to submerge the trailer, thats the boat and trailer setup

that car will pull a com-pac 16 without a problem

   the subie is no truck but should have no problem with the 16. i don't know what the tow rating is but the 16 only weights 1100 w/o trailer. not a lot. i would suggest that after a you get the boat test your braking ability and gauge your driving appropriately. many small cars have pretty small brakes and are not really made for the extra weight to stop. drive conservatively and you should be fine. the 1500 is a good price for a 16. i sold mine last year for 2300. it was a 81 model.

Quote from: mr.jadkowski on June 06, 2018, 06:06:02 AM
I'm  thinking about buying a 1983 16 on a Magic Tilt trailer. I looked at the boat yesterday and for the price (<$1500) both the boat and the trailer are in great shape. There are a few small projects to be done, like replacing some missing small hardware, but I think it's a steal and I really want the boat.

My problem is that when I backed my Subaru Crosstrek up to the trailer to eyeball it, I can't see how I would ever be able to get the boat off the trailer on a normal boat ramp without seriously submerging the back of the car. I know other people are trailering these boats with smaller cars, so how big of a problem is it? I've been reading about the hitch/tongue extensions, and I think that eventually I could cobble something together, but my main question is this:

Is it just a pain, or is it nearly impossible to launch and recover a 16 off the Magic Tilt trailer with a small car on an average boat ramp?

I haven't found a good solution to the extension problem that wasn't too expensive, too bulky, or over my level of fabrication ability. The closest thing I've found is to stack a couple of 18" hitch extensions at the boat ramp to get the hitch further back. Any other good/cheap off the shelf solitions?

Check your PM's

V.

Well, after a talk with Vipersdad about some launching ideas, I agreed to buy the boat for $1300. I guess I'm a boat owner!

Mr.J congrats on a fine purchase. Where else could you find a very sturdy small cruising boat,
cabable of sleeping aboard  at about 1500 lbs trailering weight. On average ramps I will only
reverse until the rear vehicle tires are touching the water. The tops of the fenders of the trailer are under water and the boat should float off the trailer. It seems the original Hutchins and Magic Tilt
Trailers have a longer built up trailer tongue to help launch. On my local lake there are two
ramps to launch boats. One is shallower and can easily launch a bass boat but if the water is low can be a challenge for the Compac. There is another ramp on the lake which can easlily launch a Catalina 22 so it is a dream with the Cp-16. So pick your ramps too, if you can. Also you may want to install
Bearing Buddies on the trailer to keep water out of the bearings.
Mike

I had a 6 foot long extension made which stores under the tongue of my trailer. I used it a few times on very shallow ramps and it worked very well. since moving to deeper and steeper lakes I have not used it for many years.
Fair winds and smooth seas
Smokey
CP16 Seahawk

Congrats on being a boat owner!  I have a Jeep Renegade and have never immersed the back tires more than 1-2 inches in the water when launching with no extension.  It's not been a problem at all.  Granted my car might be a little taller than a Subaru, but its still a small car. 

I'll toss in $.02.  Keep the change as necessary.

I would suggest investing in the trailer extension.  A trailer or metal fabrication shop should be able to crank out a 3-5 ft hitch extension bar for you at a low cost.  You would not tow with the bar in place but rather only launch and retrieve.   It will definitely help to keep the back end dry, especially on shallow ramps. 

Also be super careful on the road.  Your Xtrek has a 1,500 rating which is about what you'll be towing without an outboard or other accessories (battery, gear) in tow.   Are you planning on bringing your family?  Have you looked at the GVWR compared to all the people/gear/towing weight?    I saw be careful as it's probably going to dramatically change the way the car handles, brakes and accelerates.

Quick update: So far, I have found the extension to be unnecessary. On an average ramp, I can get the boat in the water without putting my back tires in the water without using the tilt feature of the trailer. The Crosstrek tows the CP16 just fine; no issues with accelerating, braking, or handling. It's slow, but it's slow without the boat and trailer so that's nothing new. I do plenty of engine braking to give my brakes a rest, but I can still do a pretty respectable panic stop if needed. The only issue I've run into is when dragging the boat and trailer out of the water on a sandy ramp. I had the trailer wheels buried almost to the axles on a cement ramp that was covered with 6" of sand, and it required a lot of clutch slipping to get the boat up and out. It was the one time that I wish I had an automatic transmission.

That's great to hear!     Those Crosstreks are pretty awesome.  My wife wants one and might just get one in a couple of years.

You may not need an extension. It really depends on what ramps you use and how they are designed. You'll know if you need it. And then you won't have one, so you may as well think about getting one.  You can buy 24" versions for not much $.

The CVT tranny is a pretty neat invention, but I can see it clutching on you on the ramp.

I wonder if it would help to give a lot more throttle for the clutch to grab and match the demand? Let the AWD system take care of traction demands (ie don't let up if you hear the wheels spinning and tossing debris). Get up off the ramp as fast as possible--haul (ass) up it.    The faster it can lock and get up off the ramp would generate the least heat.  I don't know, just thinking out loud.  I'm old school and am avoiding CVT's as long as possible.

It will be interesting to see how the new Subaru Ascent holds up to towing with a 2.5l turbo and heavier CVT.  It will probably be pretty popular in the north.

Quote from: Salty19 on July 22, 2018, 08:23:43 PM
The CVT tranny is a pretty neat invention, but I can see it clutching on you on the ramp.

I actually have a six speed manual in my Crosstrek. I think the CVT would work well for towing though, since it can hold a very low gear ratio and it also has a torque converter (I believe). My problem is that to get enough power to pull the boat and trailer up the ramp I had to rev the engine high and then slip the clutch. It was not very nice to the clutch! I guess I should avoid ramps with 6" of sand on them.

I have an Impreza with a 5 speed stick.  It goes through snow and dirt better than anything else I've owned, even a Audi Q5, and older Cherokee.  I wanted the Crosstrek but couldn't justify the extra $8K used ones were going for at the time.

Big thing is to get the traction control off.  Better yet, I put an inline switch in the fuse to the stability control.  You have to turn the ignition off, cut the fuse, turn it back on, and the dash light up like a Christmas tree.  Stability control, traction control, and hill assist all go off.  Then you can do donuts on the ice and dirt all day long without the pesky rear brakes kicking in.  Should help a lot with spinning out of the sand at ramps.  I haul my beach cat with the Impreza and it handles it well.

I would expect your jacked up Impreza should be even better!

I wish I was spinning! The problem is that the car has too much traction for the amount of power the engine can produce at low RPMs and I have to slip the clutch a lot to keep from stalling. It works, but the smell coming from the clutch makes me think it's not a good long-term game plan!

Quote from: mr.jadkowski on July 24, 2018, 08:52:42 PM
I wish I was spinning! The problem is that the car has too much traction for the amount of power the engine can produce at low RPMs and I have to slip the clutch a lot to keep from stalling. It works, but the smell coming from the clutch makes me think it's not a good long-term game plan!

Try using a higher gear such as 3rd...

Jon

Quote from: Jon898 on July 25, 2018, 08:08:52 AM
Try using a higher gear such as 3rd...

Wouldn't that require more clutch slipping to keep the car from stalling?

Reduces the traction, so lets the engine rev lower for the same wheel rotation.  It's what some manufacturers use for snow conditions.  You'll still have to slip the clutch until you get moving, but shouldn't be as pronounced...you're just trying to get things moving without spinning the wheels.  Of course the real solution, as you said - avoid ramps with 6" of sand on them!

Jon

Wow, I am surprised to hear it has a manual!  That's a good thing, at least compared to a CVT.  Still, the same principles apply.  Clutch slipping=heat=reduced life of the clutch plate material. 

My original thoughts still stand.  Rev it up, get the clutch out as soon as you can without bogging down and get up off that ramp pronto.  Let the AWD system take care of traction--you may slip a little but don't let that distract you.

I hauled the boat out from a non-sand covered concrete and asphalt ramp last weekend and it was a non-event. Getting the boat on the trailer while getting rocked by the wakes from passing ferries and lobster boats was another story!

I had some issue loading my Eclipse on the trailer in rough water a couple times early this season.  Invested in a pair of guides (goalposts) for the trailer and it's been much easier since.  You can mark the water level with tape or permanent marker on the post so backing into the proper depth for launch/haul out is always spot on. 

For years I used my 2009 Forester to launch my CP-16 (in freshwater) but my ramp is so shallow that I had to back in to where the exhaust pipes were bubbling in the water.  I'm sure this is a bad idea but the car seemed to tolerate it fine.  I would leave the car running and parked on an uphill angle for a while after launching, to allow the mufflers clear their throats.  I daresay this would be a real bad idea in saltwater but my Subaru seemed none the worse for it.  Then my neighbor bought a Kubota tractor that I can borrow for boat launch........ ;-)
Lee in VT